I keep reading posts where the both non-ADD and ADD spouses alike say "it's not the person, it's the ADD". Who cares? Why is ADD an excuse for my husband to fight with me over everything, make the most ordinary everyday things a battle that turns into a major altercation? I'm sick and tired of everything being my fault! I'm tired of the person who is supposed to love me talking to me like I'm a piece of crap and treating any random person way better than me. I'm sick of him blurting out rude and inappropriate things in social settings. I'm tired of him telling everyone things I asked him not to tell, but God help me if I tell anybody our "business", because he will freak out and let me know what a horrible wife I am. I am done.
like living with a ticking time bomb and you never know when it's going to explode. I deserve better. NO ONE deserves to live like this. I can't trust my own husband. I can't trust him with my feelings and I sure as heck can't trust him to do anything he ever says he will. I don't care if he has ADD. That's not an excuse. I hate the "poor me" attitude. He always blames everything on someone else. It's because his parents weren't there for him, it's because he was always in trouble as a kid, it's because his home life was unstable. Boo hoo. My mom has been sick and going downhill since I was 9 years old. She could no longer walk by the time I was 14, when I was 19 she went into a nursing home, and now I'm 32 and she's on hospice. You don't hear me crying that I get to be a complete jerk and bury my head in the sand because I had it rough growing up. ADD is NOT an excuse to be mean. It's not an excuse to treat your loved ones like crap. It's not an excuse to scream at your 2 year old and her to run to me crying "daddy's mean".
If you had cancer, you'd get chemo or whatever else to treat it. But because you have ADD, you refuse to admit you are ever the problem, it's everyone and everything else causing your bad attitude. I am sick of it. I want to know what life is like with someone who values me, puts me first, treats me the way I deserve to be treated. For years I have worked to be the perfect spouse and the better I get, nicer I am, the meaner he seems to be.
I'm sorry, but I am so incredibly angry and fed up. I refuse to live the rest of my life like this. And from everything I've read, even if he gets treatment, he'll still have a lot of these traits.
I hear your anger and frustration
Submitted by MikeZ on
As a man who was diagnosed with ADHD as a young child and suffered with it his whole life, only really dealing with it the past few years I can see both sides of this. I do agree with you its not an excuse to act in a negative way. But it is a label just like cancer or alcoholism and describes a certain condition. The alchohlic should get treatment, the cancer paitent should get chemo or something, and the person with ADD\ADHD needs to want to get help and be willing to make changes to improve both your lives. If your partner has no interest in acting different and is okay then you are right, its almost pointless to expect anything to be different or change and staying might make you unhappy resentfull etc for the rest of your life. However if your partner is in therapy and really trying to get better and agrees there is a problem maybe you can both work it out and try some kind of counseling together even where you can both understand eachother more.
Thank you for this response
Submitted by momof2toddlers-... on
What you said is true, if he had some great desire to change, get help, even acknowledge that not everything is my fault, that's it's not even possible for everything to always be one person's fault, there might be some hope. The problem is that he knows he has ADHD, I've told him repeatedly how much it is hurting our relationship and our family, but he either agrees with me and does nothing about it, or he gets angry and says "you're mean too". Real mature. Or he just uses the ADHD as an excuse for all of his bad behavior. He did start counseling and is about to get on meds, but the counselor does not specialize in ADHD and so far all they've talked about is his relationship with his parents. He is convinced that all his issues are the fault of his upbringing, not so much the ADHD. It seems even more frustrating that he's finally initiated help, but I don't know how helpful it's really going to be. There is no light at the end of the tunnel as far as I can see. I don't want my children to be a product of divorce, but I also don't want them to think that this is what an adult relationship should look like.
wow were you at my place last night?
Submitted by jnw010683 on
Find strength
Submitted by jennalemon on
To momof2toddlers, I am feeling the same things you are right now. My mom died in November after 5 years of degrading dementia. I do not get to be able to rely on/depend/trust DH even now that I am dealing with loss. Maybe some of my heightened anger concerning my ADD DH has to do with my grief and that I don't feel like being the strong one right now. My stomach is twirling with the anxiety anyone would feel after the chairs have been pulled out from under you a thousand times by the person you WANT to love but it makes you too crazy and stupid to trust anymore. I am writing these things for myself as much as for you.
I know many people are in the world alone and in the end you have to face some of your own realities by yourself. Where to find the strength? How to nurture a wholeness within yourself to trust life and yourself? Here is what I know: Everything is very OK. All people have difficult times in their lives. If we are full of anxiety right now it is because it is our turn to go through a difficult time. Don't give up on life - especially if you have children. Situations get better and situations may get worse - that's life. Have faith. Meditate, reach out for community, find laughter and the assurance that you are NOT alone. Get moving, exercise. Be good to yourself and eat a divine meal in a divine place when things are the worst just to change the scenery. Make your body look good. Run. Make time to do some things you LOVE. Give yourself the freedom to live your life passionately. Don't live your life for others all the time - even for your spouse or children. They need you to be a model for how to get through difficulties and how to make tough decisions and keep on track with what is important. We need to hear the words over and over. You are very OK. You are going through a difficult time. Respect yourself and love your loved ones enough to listen to your heart. Take the risks you know you need to take. Hold your head up and walk with confidence. Do yourself proud no matter what others are doing around you.
jennalemon, thanks
Submitted by momof2toddlers-... on
Thank you for your kind words and good advice. I do try to take some time for me, it is hard with a husband who acts put upon when I leave the kids with him for any period of time, but I do try. I lost 80 pounds since the birth of my son 15 months ago and am smaller than I was when I met my husband. But he still suggested that I should get a tummy tuck, he's really great at building my self-esteem ;-).
I'm so sorry about your mom. Mine has a progressive form of Multiple Sclerosis and has been close to death a couple of times, but she hangs on. My DH won't even go to visit her at the nursing home with us unless I guilt him into it. It's too boring for him. I just feel alone and I'm also sick of walking on eggshells all the time. I'm always supposed to be sunshine and roses and I'm supposed to "get over it" whenever he's mean or miserable. When I don't immediately "get over it", he's right back to being angry with me. I can never win. I'm just starting to feel like my life would be so much easier and more peaceful without him in it. I am afraid of what weekend visitation with the kids would be like with him. I selfishly don't want to spend weekends without my kids. I don't want to not spend holidays with them. But then I think I shouldn't stay with him just because of the kids because I don't want them to have us as their example of an adult relationship. We are so dysfunctional. I know he loves me, but his mood swings are unbearable.
There I go venting again, I just found this forum and it's hard to stop typing this stuff out once I get started. It feels so good to be able to vent to people who understand where I'm coming from.
Thanks again, I do need to take some yoga or meditate. Stress is wearing me down.
wow, you said it
Submitted by lynninny on
"I just feel alone and I'm also sick of walking on eggshells all the time. I'm always supposed to be sunshine and roses and I'm supposed to "get over it" whenever he's mean or miserable." Wow, momof2, this really hit home. I think that this has been the most painful part of my relationship with my DH. Even if he is rude, or mean, or in a terrible mood, or grouchy beyond belief in the morning, if I don't just sail through it, and "get over it," then that's when the trouble starts. Not only does he respond by being defensive, he actually turns it on me and makes me out to be the bad guy, as if the anger is all my problem or that I hold onto things. I have just now begun to see what it really going on--all those years I was so wounded that the person I loved would not show any empathy for my feelings, and only react to me with anger or defensiveness. I have also had the painful experience of having him treat a stranger or colleague nicely, calmly, and with respect, right in front of me, and I just can't believe he can't treat me like that.
I also have a chronically ill person in my house. In my case, it is my DH, and it has thrown a wrench into this whole thing, but also gives me so much sympathy and admiration for you and jennalemon. It is a huge thing to be "on" 24-7 taking care of a family and someone who is sick. And to not feel the support from your spouse, really can leave you feeling very alone. I don't know what I am going to do at this point--I feel very obligated to help him, I don't think he has the strength or focus to work on things with me while this sick, but he never has before and it has been years and I am so burned out and fed up that I know I can't go on much longer like this.
I don't know what the answer is or what the moment is that you realize you have done all you can, that your relationship is not good for you, and that you have tried hard enough. We're pretty dysfunctional, too. Divorce is obviously tough on kids but so must be watching an unhealthy relationship and experiencing a lot of strife and anger in the household. Stress can wear you down--I feel 100 years old and get migraines all the time. Which doesn't help me be a good mother:-) I do know I am at the point I saw in the forum post. I don't CARE anymore if it is the ADHD or something else, I really don't. It doesn't make it any better to have him yell or blurt out something hurtful or forget that he yelled at me that morning, to think that it could be attributed to his ADHD. It's just not ok and I don't deserve it.
I know how you feel
Submitted by veg_girl on
Momof2toddlers, I know how you feel. It's a terribly lonely place, bring married to a partner who doesn't act like a partner, who can't remember to follow through on even the most basic responsibilities, who only defends, deflects, and denies...
ADD should not be used as an excuse--nothing should ever give someone permission to act unkind or disrespectful. There's a line in a Kimya Dawson song that I love: having been f*cked is no excuse for being f*cked up. And it just sums up so much so perfectly. I know people who have come through the worst of the worst, but you'd never know it. They don't use it as an excuse, they don't use it to get attention or pity, they use it only as a reminder of their strength. So I don't have much empathy for my DH when he complains about his upbringing and his parents (they were loving, did the best they knew how, but made some little mistakes along the way, as all new parents do--he was never beaten or abused or abandoned...)
I think for me it has been important to keep in mind that it's my DH's ADD traits/symptoms that I can't stand, or at least, I can't stand when he allows his ADD symptoms to control his life and therefore mine. I still have glimpses of the person I fell in love with, and that's who I consider to be the real person my DH is--he is not his ADD symptoms--I try to remember that when he's oblivious to everything going on around him, that he doesn't mean to act like a selfish jerk...And I have an ongoing debate with myself (and anyone else who cares to comment every now and then) about what really matters, action or intention. For what it's worth, I have basically decided that action is more important, but intention must be worth something to me or else I would have left long ago. It's tough, though, and most days I feel just like you do--that it does not matter why someone acts the way they do if the effects are hurtful. No one deserves this kind of a life. Everyone deserves the right to pursue his/her own happiness.
Take care and keep updating us.
The Trauma of Enduring ADHD by NON the ADHD
Submitted by ADHDWE on
Those with ADHD are short on DOPAMINE, noradrenaline and norepinephrine, and likely over methylated. ADHD may need to see an Integrative Health doctor to get blood tested for under or over methylation, only a doctor can prescribe based off of blood tests, supplements like vitamin B12 without Folic acid (too much folic acid), glutathione, and or N-Acetylcysteine, Inositol. There's a method to the layout of supplementation. My business partner is part Trump, Mr. Magoo and Denise the Menace. His therapist of 12 years shrugged her shoulders when I mentioned ADD traits within him, and said "it wasn't her bailiwick"! I have finally figured it out after 23 years of horrible divide in our business and him with others throughout his life, with two divorces and lots of women leaving him, one of his children estranged, business colleagues who reject him. I am traumatized, and hardly mending, and I AM LEAVING him for my own sanity and from his abuse; unwitting or not, as he is both aware and unaware. But just an island to himself, and unruly to others, just horrible and discourteous and mean, shouting to customer service folks. He's NEVER wrong. A great book about Adult Hyperactivity Deficit Disorder with comorbid Narcissism is NOT uncommon. This starts in childhood when ADHD and dyslexia is undiagnosed and so not handled correctly, especially PARENTS who are unwittingly brutal. Look at Baron. Super smart and I hope they are surrounding him with expertise. This stuff is genetic. Well, who in the 1950's knew about ADHD? Book is called : "Is it You, Me or ADHD?" Those with ADHD are Mr. Magoo's and Denise the Menace, bulls in china shops with physicality and with words and actions with nearly no EMPATHY for themselves or others. They lack self love, but want to be loved so badly, but are arrogant as heck and unapologetic, defensive, scared of being shamed and shown to be wrong, skeptical of others, paranoid (at times). Everyone is wrong and they are right. Acting of age range between 5 and 15, rarely fully adult 100%. They are impulsive in speech, action, thought, impatient, grumpy, charismatic, impatient again, frenetic, hyper, cannot sleep, cannot follow rules, cannot handle TMI coming at them, cannot admit when wrong, will blame others for their mistakes because they cannot handle the SHAME of being ADHD, or dyslexic, or blamed for making mistakes as a child or as an adult. NOT ENOUGH DOPAMINE OR OVERMETYLATED. They lack INTROSPECTION because it's too shameful scared over to access. They don't even know HOW to access themselves. Their executive functions for everyday transacting are SHOT to hell. Nothing there. Some, they cannot manage much of anything at once. Did I say grumpy and irritable and cannot focus on conversations for very long if not about them? Notice they shake their foot when legs are crossed, fidgety too. They are unaware of their actions, their memory and hearing is selective, they will tell you that you "misremembered". They do not retain agreements. Then they blame you when they forget, project and project. They know something is wrong with them, but are not equipped to figure it out. It's like groundhog day with them. They will not remember to be AWARE of physicality, impulses or agreements or conversations. You want to strangle them sometimes for the GASLIGHTING of your reality. They like to push your buttons. You RESCUE THEM ALL THE TIME not because you want to, but because you mostly don't have a choice to divert failure or exigent circumstances. Some, I say some, not all, they are SLOBS, utter slobs. Hand prints, greasy prints everywhere, and oblivious to surroundings with dishes, food waste, moldy food, papers, clothes, tidiness far from. My Biz partners home was in near squalor, His inside of car ruins, Exterior dented all over the place. Some make a mess and break things everywhere they go. Some, you cannot leave them alone in your home, or lend them your car. Some are disheveled, dress dirty. Most are smart and focus on one thing well, accomplished in one area and have succeeded to exclusion of other things, so focus is limited. I wish I could help, and I've tried, and tried. But I'm wrung out from the abuse. This is so damaging for those around them too. Imagine a life of invalidation and rewriting of your reality and history at the hand of some one who has ADHD with co-morbid Narcissism?! Even when you describe them, they cannot see themselves. If you have someone with ADHD you can try to stay, but better to RUN FOR THE HILLS if they wont get help. Even then, you'll all ways be the parent in some respect. Don't believe the therapists who tell you you have to stop rescuing. You've got no choice when they can't clean up the same mess the third time and then they get mad at you for asking or when you won't help clean the vase they broke to a thousand pieces. They get banned from homes on holiday bc they say that "waterboarding is an appropriate form of torture" in front of people they have only met for 15 minutes. Next time test the next president for mental health- fitness, not just physical.
adhdwe.....
Submitted by c ur self on
As I read this; I realized it's probably the best description of how high level (my wife) add minds live, act, react....I have been married to her since 2008....I've experienced most, if not all of the things you have listed here on a regular basis.....
I did all the things I shouldn't have early on (4 plus years)....Things like trying to communicate to her, her lack of marital effort and concern....Thinks like pointing out her complete unconcern for everything she vowed to make important, that she really took no thought of (without reminders, and even then she is victim minded about it)....I even made it so much worse out of ignorance, thinking it was all intentional acts, falling into the mothering traps, the egg shell walking, it was BAD.....
It took me a long time to realize that I could beat her down if I wanted to...But she had no ability to sustain change....So it finally came down to what is possible if I stay?
What I found was, because her life isn't one that is capable of sharing, (unity) due to the extreme things you listed (hyper focus, works hard to control & manipulate, never wrong, self absorbed, unable to track in conversation, etc) that I, for peace sake, her's and mine, had to live committed, but, like she doesn't exist in many area's of daily life..."Boundaries"....
So we kind of live like two single people in our home...We show some affection, and we share some meals, I try to ignore unfiltered comments, I try to not react, I try to laugh at her and walk away, when I know, like you said, she want hear much of anything related to her behaviors, jumps strait to blame, and the whole cycle of conflict just starts all over.....
I do my best to avoid any type mothering, but, again like you said, it's about impossible to not step in some area's because as a spouse your effected by their environment...(same spaces) But, I've been pretty successful with this, just because of solid boundaries....
You have to be willing to have other ways to enjoy your life that does not include them...(keep your stress level down, with no expectations for them to be different) Or you will always be fueling their dysfunctional behaviors....You cannot allow them to hold anything over you that keeps you coming back, you have to force them to be self aware and accountable....This is a must for many adders, (their minds in many cases are designed to use others, in order to have any organization in their lives) you have to wisely force effort in the relationship....Up until a year or two ago, I had this one thing she knew she could use against me if she held out long enough....Sex....I had to get to the point that I didn't allow sex to cause me to seek peace between us, when she needed to approach me about her actions....It took a while, and effort, :), but, it's been better....My wife has a heart that can be touched, and I trust that she has been faithful....She will do shame driven work (even if complaining) in the house if we are having company...I usually find something to do out side the house when this last minute overdose on adderall barrage starts, in order to avoid her comments, and her wanting to use me to do it, when she forces me to put up w/ little to no effort or awareness daily:)....I calmly tell her, when you start caring about the environment that your husband endures, then this problem will go away....
Love your post
c
The Trauma of the NON ADHD Partner
Submitted by ADHDWE on
Thank you for commiserating with me. I know and feel your frustration and angst. I too pass like a ship in the night with my friend and business partner, since I live in the same home, but in a separate studio.
I'm actively looking for ways out of my situation by planning with my therapist, and this will take some time. I hope you have a therapist to help you find ways to be accountable for the way you wish to live your life: to stay or distance or to go. It's the hardest thing to find a way through this.
For me; getting through it, just mean's accepting it....
Submitted by c ur self on
As long as I don't backslide and let my guard down about her reality I do well....I have a wonderful life, a God who loves me... I have loving healthy children and grand children, I have great friends...My wife is sweet as pie at times....But when she gets distracted by something, some place, or someone...I have to recognize I've lost her, and not give it another thought and go on with my life....As long as I do that, her mind has no control on my life and emotions....
It's only when I get lost in attempting to fix, point out, or allow myself to think it could be different do I suffer....And after 13 years of knowing and experiencing what I have, it self inflicted if I do....I wish you well in your efforts to move past the burden....
c
It makes adults act like
Submitted by SJC2021 on
It makes adults act like spoiled , selfish brats sometimes no doubt.
Control what you can control. They are chaos . Always will be.
Get out and find peace.
Our experiences are subjective. When unsustainable… RUN!
Submitted by ADHDWE on
My business partner has had ADD for most of his life and it's undiagnosed. All I know is that I've seen the wrath and the wake of destruction left in his life. The older we get, the less time we have left on our lives. Precious, precious time that we have for ourselves. And I say all the following with as much love toward ADD and non-ADD persons. Chances are anyone reading this has been dealing with ADD for a while. Are you tired of it yet? How valuable is your life and the lives of your children? Only you know that. Only you can stand back and get individual therapy to assess the situation from a macro view. And you need to get it alone. No sense in taking the ADD partner with you to therapy. After all, "accountability" is the path to curing ADD. And all the times I've went to therapy with my ADD business partner and friend, nothing fruitful has come of it long-term. It's short-lived. Why? Because they have attention deficit disorder! Get that through your head. It is a genetic issue. Don't expect long-term solutions unless you are willing to bend like a pretzel and forget who you are. I do believe those who have ADD in which it is a "mild case" stand a chance at working things out with their partners. However, when you have a treatment resistant ADD partner who has comorbid narcissism due to the shame they have endured because of their ADD, this creates complex problems in character disorders. Start reading up on it as much as you can. It's a lot more entangled than we think. And I'm tired of therapist and advice articles telling us just hang in there and give a little bit more. We've already given and given and given by the time we've sought help. We're already threadbare and worn out by the time we realize that we have ADD on our hands. I've grown real tired of hearing the broken record about how much the non-ADD folks need to support the ADD. That wears out after about the fifth year. And the folks helping the one with ADD, well, it depends how codependent we are with them. So it does have two sides to the story. My only responsibility to myself is to find out whether I'm being codependent or whether I can step back far enough from my ADD partner and run for the hills. This life is too short. I don't mind working hard at a relationship, however, I need someone on the other end who's going to "Be capable" of sustained results to hold up the ceiling with me, and my ADD partner is NOT that man. Oh the years of placating and trying to understand and emphasize and work with him. The wreckage that he leaves with me and others. The dismissive attitude. The blaming. The refusal to accept accountability for one's actions. The constant teenage -itis. You know what I'm talking about! Stop. Stop victimizing the non-ADD partners. If we are going to look at helping those with ADD, then we need to look at helping those who don't have it and dealing with those who do have it. And these advice articles to continue to work and mold the clay are not enough. Most of them miss the fact that comorbid narcissism is already in there. Narcissism is an almost irretractable character trait. And when it's wedded to ADD, hold on tight. The ride gets real rough. Thank goodness for this website. I'm sorry that those who suffer with ADD are hurting so much and that they've gotten a raw genetic deal or they are low on dopamine and undiagnosed or the drugs don't work, or the changes don't work. Life sucks. And that goes to waste. Sorry. It just is what it is. My advice. Leave the situation. Leave the situation. Leave the situation. That's real love for oneself and the person with ADD. The tough decisions are the ones that take a huge amount of love. God knows I gave it my best.
Amen, ADHDWE
Submitted by 1Melody1 on
Could not agree more with much of this. So often the non-ADHD partner is the one drowning and the life preserver is thrown to the person pushing them under. It has to change. Why are partners of narcissists told to go no-contact while partners of those with ADHD are labelled codependent and advised to lower expectations and stop being so angry? It's maddening and it's wrong. Good for you for drawing your line in the sand. It took me more than a decade of torturing myself to get there too.
Regarding “Amen”
Submitted by ADHDWE on
Good for you as well, Melody. Thank you for your reply. My very best to you.
Yes
Submitted by adhd32 on
Exactly. Narcissists are seen as evil perpetrators but the ADDer is seen as the victim of nature. Both produce the same result in a victimized spouse yet one victim garners sympathy while the other is basically told to change to accommodate the perpetrator. Both conditions are permanent and yield the same emotional results in their partner. Instead of advising non partners to suck it up, tell them to plan their escape and seek legal advice so they know their options.
This thread is so on point, I
Submitted by Armoniamundi on
This thread is so on point, I have kept it open for the last week in order to be able to re-read it. I find the honesty is so refreshing, especially the unspoken expectations assumed from the non part, and recognizing my emotions and stances in what you shared is truly therapeutic. I think it's impossible to heal from the PTSD resulting from chaos and betrayal who brought us to this forum, unless we can assert and respect our true emotions and needs. I broke up with my adhd ex last october, yesterday I created my account and this is my first comment. Thank you.