After several day's of quiet reflection and thought concerning our struggles. I've come to the conclusion my wife is unapproachable...It hasn't stopped me from trying for 7+ years...But the fruit of my attempts hasn't changed much of anything for the better anyway.... I know we learn to navigate some of the behaviors and some of our differences without to much damage to the relationship by trail and error eventually...But, a person who lives in a mind that has these faces most all the time: Competitive, Denial, Combative, Controlling, Forgetful, Self-Absorbed, who is a hoarder and who swings from extreme Independence to super co-dependence....Is unapproachable....
Now when you place her in a relationship with a Husband who is a Type A engaging talker, that loves intimacy and thinks there is nothing that can't be conquered with love and hard work...(Sadly my own denial) You have a recipe for disaster! The moral of this equation is: Believe what you see, learn to be quiet, and never put words in a person's mouth. If they can't say it and show it, it's probably not there....
Bad is Good if you accept it and find peace with it.....
C
Unapproachable?
Submitted by Happyl on
Have you discussed this outright with your wife? Acceptance is ok but be sure this is the behavior she is choosing and that she's unwilling to make a change.
Change is coming; simply by
Submitted by c ur self on
Change is coming; simply by not approaching. I've given up on verbally pointing out the dysfunction. Hopefully my silence and refusal to engage will say more than the words that were only bouncing off the strong wall of denial....
I've decided I had to have peace, if I never have a wife...Besides; trying to point out things to someone who always meets your attempts with a defensive and combative posture only produces frustrations and makes me just another part of the problem...Self inflicted at that!
C
c ur self.....being unapproachable
Submitted by dedelight4 on
I highly respect you C, for your stance on life, and learning to live peacefully and so eloquently with your wife. I do understand about the "unapproachable" part of what you said. My ADHD husband is "very" unapproachable in his demeanor, his countenance, facial expressions, general attitude, and often being hostile with words, sounds and actions. I think it's what's made us (our family) feel like we have to always "walk on eggshells" around him so much, because he seem so ANGRY, so much of the time. I've discussed this with him many times over, and TO that, he angrily responds, "I'M NOT ANGRY"!!!! Which doesn't do much to convince me how angry he's NOT. Many people over the years have said this to him, and he responds the same way to them. But, if he could actually SEE himself on video, maybe it would show him what he looks like to the outside world. (not just us family members)
But, this unapproachable attitude almost seems like his way of avoidance, so he doesn't have to deal with the rest of us, or deal with ANY situation he doesn't like. To me, it's a form of control. Maybe passive-aggressive, or aggressive-aggressive, or covert aggressive, I'm not sure. But, whatever , it doesn't serve him in positive ways. But, he's been getting SOME SORT of pay off from it, to keep on doing it all these years.
Anyway, hugs to you, and wishing you well.
Dede...Thank you....I have the same respect for you....
Submitted by c ur self on
I would love to see us; all of us, reach a level of understanding that would allow us to know how to live as peacefully with each other as possible (Be Happy:)...Or at least be free of the baggage that has formed over the years so we can decide in a sound mind, and peaceful spirit (no anger, hurt or bitterness) what is best for our lives moving forward....
Here are few of my feelings based on my studies and experiences....Minds that suffer at or near Clinical levels of adhd works in a way so many of us can't completely understand...It will produce outbursts that in my opinion cannot be responded to if an adult does it, especially those of us who have emotional attachments...(A counselor or therapist can because the are trained and have little to no emotional attached) The labels we place on them (passive-aggressive etc...) may be true from a pure clinical perspective...But, its not the reality in their mind, so because we are subject to our learning, reasoning and level of understanding our emotions get drug into it and we become offended...It's no way to avoid it, if we chose to engage them at this moment...
When a mind is functioning purely from on an intuitive level, it is very difficult (almost impossible) for those of us who have the ability to "reason" to understand them...It's a whole different Logic...Also there is little to no ability for and add mind to see things rationally, their efforts tend be excuses and rationalization... These differences effect most everything an interdependent relationship (sharing, engaging, empathy, communication) of two being one is built on. So to maintain communications and trust is very difficult, not impossible I'm learning, but difficult....
Logic In the Chambers of the Heart C
Submitted by kellyj on
C,
I read this thread through a couple of times (all the comments made) and without taking offense at all and just reading this objectively and constructively....I see something here that might help you see a different possibility than the ones you are speculating? I'll show you what I mean by taking all the adjectives used here alone and throwing them into a pile.
Here's the list describing a person with ADHD
Unapproachable, competitive, combative, denial, controlling, self absorbed, forgetful, hoarder, extreme independence, super co-dependence ( which is really dependent....you can't be co-dependent officially unless there is someone else involved), minds that suffer, not reality in their mind, a mind functioning purely on an intuitive level, a whole different Logic, little to no ability for an add mind to see things rationally, efforts tend be excuses and rationalization and then finally passive aggressive. For the moment...let's take passive aggressive out of the equation here....
Now...here's the list of things you said about yourself
Type A engaging talker, that loves intimacy and thinks there is nothing that can't be conquered with love and hard work.
In complete respect to your opinion here...and with my best intentions on your behalf...."an opinion" is just that: A personal belief based entirely on yourself and the culmination of your feelings, your beliefs, your understanding of what these things mean along with the assumptions and speculations that support your beliefs (including any doctrine or dogmatic arguments along with things you've learned or have to told or taught and believe they are true) and then coming to a conclusion or personal assessment and thinking that you are correct. (which makes sense based on having an opinion...that is, mostly, none of us have one in the first place unless we believe them to be true or correct now what I mean?)
What if you changed any number of these adjectives (and the reasons you have to support them in your mind) and change those words to something else to describe the same thing? Would that change your opinion and how you see yourself and your wife by simply believing something different than what you believe now?
Also....feelings and emotions are not logical. The full quote in the title of my comment is " It's a fool who looks for logic in the chambers of the heart" is a good one here. Opinions are based on logic and reason.....love and emotions are not... and are personal and individual.(sole ownership belongs to only one person...the person who has them)
Trying to combine them and make sense out of that is what is not possible? Your perception and how you see these things will change at the same time you change how you see the same thing but apply a different word to describe it. The word is not what is important...it's the belief you have that underlines the word is what you have to change?
And just so you know here C.....I have failed miserably at everything I just told you. I have also found that everything that I just said works exactly as stated when ever I find the courage to do it and live with what I don't like that much about myself once I do. It's the very thing that makes me do it even more:)
Peace brother:)
J
Thanks J
Submitted by c ur self on
The adjectives I used to describe my wife's living of life as you know are intermittent...They pop up when least expected (especially when I'm all smiles and engaging, comfortable) and I almost never handle it well...I know you like to say "it's not about me" and you are correct, but, it effects me, and not in a good way...So what's the real problem here? Reason and logic says do something different, cause your still getting it wrong. LOL..
I thing before the honey moon was over I new this (when she was shooting me the bird from across the isle in the plane, it put me in shock instead of understand her and laughing at it ) but, because it goes against who I am, and what I felt a healthy marriage should look like I wouldn't accept it, so I've been in denial.
So I am forced to live with much less interaction than I desire because (lets throw out all the adjectives, and exchange them for one word...Actions) of her actions. So, because I've felled so miserably at being a non-emotional, mature husband who can endure these words and actions and keep smiling I've had to get out my box (my desires for this marriage) and live very uncomfortable (silent LOL) so I can be the mature Husband who can keep his emotions in check.
And its working...But it's hard just being two ships in the night....
By the way, I definitely meant Co-dependent but it should have been on my side of the ledger....Co-dependent relationships are a type of dysfunctional helping relationship where one person supports or enables another person's addiction, poor mental health, immaturity, irresponsibility, or under-achievement.
I know you don't fully understand, and if I offended you or anyone else I apologize, I think highly of you...I know you have worked your butt off to be aware, and have made every effort to help many of us to understand the workings of an adhd mind....I appreciate it....Maybe I should take a break from the forum for a while...The last thing I want to do is negatively impact others....
C
C No Way Have You Said Anything....
Submitted by kellyj on
to offend me! I know what I am...and know what I am not. Nothing anyone says is going to change that much if I am really being truthful with myself. People with ADHD come in all shapes and sizes. Honestly....hearing the pain on your side of things is exactly what I need to hear no matter how it comes out. This is the only way for me to know what it must be like for (all) of you. It's the only thing I can't get from hearing only the good parts. I think the fear is that if someone only hears the white washed version ...they might not think that it's not all that bad? In truth I think most people with ADHD just don't know. I was the same and I am still trying to get a better understanding of it.
Bottom lining you here....it' the denial. That's the difference between being able to stomach it or not and receiving the slightest hint of a criticism as a major offense. I was no different and based on your wife and what I have heard you say.....denial is the part that makes things come out all caty-wompus and irrational not as much just the ADHD by itself. This is just my opinion here but at least I have a good resource to base that on.....myself! Before and after! lol Not that I completely home free but enough to see the difference. I suspect there is more to learn and more things that I still can't see (only fewer and farther between now lol )
And now I'm the one feeling bad here. More than anything...I wanted to make a point and get you to see what I already know in that respect.....you can't do anything about your wife....all you can do is make change to yourself.
Here's the deal though. ) If she is co-dependent and you change.....so will she. If you change the ratio of two chemicals in a beaker....the reaction will change along with it once you mix them together in differing amounts. I think this is true for everyone but even more so for someone who is dependent on you and the lines are blurry between you and them. If you build it....they will come. lol
Please don't feel you said anything to offend me.....if someone else doesn't agree...that'll be up to them to say so. I will say....I understand why you are concerned using your own situation as the only way to determine how someone else might feel. The only thing I can't know is exactly what it must be like for you....but I can understand it based on other people in my past I who have been in denial for their own reasons not necessarily ADHD.
If I had a wish for you that I was not saying forth right before...is for you not to withdraw and repress your emotions ( to completely disengage and give up trying ) but to change how you see things so you can re-engage only differently. That pointing out what she was doing wrong or what you don't like is not going to get you anywhere with her....trust me on that much. That was a good move I think.
This may not be possible with your wife and only you would know that but...it is my sincerest wish that you could do something and not just give up hope or just relegate yourself to living in a way that you can't stand. I've been there...and then I snapped back and went after it again.
The most painful thing I've found is to sit and do nothing. If anything....I was offering an alternative to that without actually saying it. Doing things to improve yourself and focusing on that instead of your wife will only do you good no matter what happens. Don't give up on yourself what ever you do!
J
(( You two guys ))
Submitted by NowOrNever (not verified) on
(( You two guys ))
...I'm learning from you both. Thank you!
There's a topic in your posts about how use of faces and bodies, and in my house, loudness or softness of voice, fit or dont fit what's going on inside the person.
My heart
Submitted by jennalemone on
"It's a fool who looks for logic in the chambers of the heart" I am going to carry that quote with me today. So true. Even though I have been trying to find logic and manipulate my own heart. I tried to make myself love someone who wanted to be loved in a different way than I am able to love. Or maybe I am wrong about that, And here is where this next quote is valuable to remember. "The heart wants what the heart wants". This is not entitllement or selfish. We have hearts and souls which make up who we really are. Some of us are trying to figure out what our heart wants on this board....with logic or communion or sharing words. What does my heart want? Would I recognize it if it were in front me or have I disciplined my self so much that I imprison myself with my sadness?
Just waxing poetic with melancholy today.