I'm reflecting on the amount of real life current stories I hear about marriages turning out more or less like mine, acquaintances, same age span, with undiagnosed but suspiciously alike husbands. Silent avoidant men with some eccentricity, depression, anxiety and little visible action about them. Frustrated sad stressed out women.
There is an often told story about men who leave their wives for younger women. But we know the vast majority of marriages end when women ask for divorce. Both patterns seem to speak the same language of disappointment. A woman wanting to get out at all costs. A man craving acceptance from a woman who doesn't know him.
Maybe I'm way off the mark here with anecdotal evidence, but I sense a universal theme. How underdiagnosed might this condition be? They now believe it might be as much as 15% affected boys and 11% affected girls in my country. Some people don't qualify for diagnosis later as adults. But still. It's a lot.
My heart aches for both spouses in this painful dynamic.
My thoughts....
Submitted by c ur self on
I think it's possible that because you are a women (see and feel the women's perspective) it's common for you to feel and think these feelings and thoughts you have posted....I have read here about 12 years or so....Been married to an ADD spouse 16...I also joined a facebook group of all men, married to ADD wives, about a year ago....I can tell you that even though men and women have unique God given physical, emotional & mental features of mind and body...In my experience there isn't that much difference in what is experienced by partners of either sex, when married to ADHD spouses, and their different normal's and tendencies in life...I think the possibilities are so vast and wide ranging when it comes to the carnal mind, (birth mind) it's completely impossible to make generalizations about behaviors as it relates to men and women....
Plus, (IMO) I think it takes something spiritual to open blinded eye's....I don't think evil people understand (see) they are even evil many times....(without empathy, or feelings as it relates to others feelings, and their own indifference)...I think this way so many arguments related to blame and justification ensue...People will justify about anything looking through their carnal lens of "I want"..It's spiritual blindness in my opinion....I use to be that person....
c
Yes of course
Submitted by Swedish coast on
You're right C. I haven't had any male friends or acquaintances confide their troubles in their marriages. This is all women talking amongst themselves.
Thank you for adding a broader perspective.
Makes sense
Submitted by Catterfly on
Hi Swedish,
This is a really interesting theory. Coupled with what we know about ADHD impulsivity, it makes sense!
Diagnoses here in Canada seem to be a bit quicker so we may have more anecdotal evidence - not sure. But my husband and two teen daughters were diagnosed in the past two years.
Our eldest was the first - she was 13 at the time. We were a bit shocked as she shows none of the signs you would expect. It turns out that she internalizes all of the nervous energy and it becomes really detrimental to her. It took her mental health falling apart, and a very knowledgeable psychiatrist, to detect it. I'm thankful for him every day because I think that was the first step in saving her.
Our younger daughter has fit more of thr ADHD stereotypes. Messy room, RSD rages (which she is devastated by), and inattention. All similar to her dad. It was easy to see the patterns in them once we knew it was in the family. But without that first diagnosis, we would never have known.
This is all to say two things:
- ADHD can be almost invisible in girls and therefore very hard to detect, and
- Adults seem to be diagnosed more often when their children are diagnosed first.
So yes, I think you're right that we're only just seeing the tip of the iceberg.
It's Possible
Submitted by BeyondConfused on
I was just discussing/thinking about this yesterday while talking with a family member. I had called them because my partner had done something that left me concerned about if waiting until I have a job and a plan in place to ask him to leave was still feasible. Interestingly enough, I think this family member has ADHD too. There were a few things on a form I had when I was pursuing my diagnosis that she seemed shocked by and kept insisting that those were "normal". Or "everyone does that" so to speak. And, I didn't say a word. I shared a look with her husband and we moved on with the conversation. She went on about how her husband makes her go back into her workplace when he picks her up and double-check to make sure she hasn't forgotten anything after every single shift because she tends to leave something behind each time. I lose and misplace things a ton, so I understand. But that's not something that "everyone" does. I don't have friends that have left their entire purse in a shopping cart and only realized it when they go to head home and can't find their wallet for example. But that's something I've done more than once. And I don't view that as "normal" so to speak.
Anyway, in the discussion I was expressing frustration over a few things and she stopped me cold and said she had something to say. And then proceeded to mention how much I was using the word ADHD and that she thought I was using it as an excuse for things which are all very common and normal. Which.. no. I was at one point trying to point out how I feel that my partner uses his ADHD as an excuse for things, but I still think there is definitely an impact since he is unmedicated and has been kind of "embracing" his ADHD life and not trying to be mindful of how it impacts others. Prime example being, he has told his job he needs a lighter workload because of his ADHD. It's been a whole fight with them, because he feels he was set up to fail in his current role. He works from home, I have consistently walked by and seen him sitting and playing computer games on his personal computer or streaming movies, vs doing the work. And he's not taking his medication. This is annoying because he probably does need a lighter workload and I don't doubt he struggles, and sometimes just hits total shut down when it comes to work. But he's sitting on a computer playing a game. He's not taking his medication which was helping him focus either. He's not going to be keeping his job if he keeps on doing this. And while there might be a strong impulse to hop onto the game during a work shift, he could also move his personal computer out of the office during his work hours. Or something to help limit the temptation. He does know it's problematic because when I walk by and see it, he right away gives me excuses that he's on a break or something. And yet I don't comment on him playing games or ask about it. So it always comes across as him being well aware that he shouldn't be on there. He feels guilty, and then he's trying to alleviate said guilt by telling me that he's just on a break or whatever he tells me at the time.
So we discussed this a bit. I pointed out how I have been undiagnosed for years. I have still managed to get through life, but when I learned I had ADHD, a lot of my struggles in the past suddenly made more sense. How I struggle with focus for extended periods of time unless it's something that greatly interests me, and how I was consistently always late for work for years no matter what I did to try to get myself there on time. How I was always losing my keys, wallet, etc. and how I have trouble regulating my emotions or I feel I can get "stuck" in arguments and feel this desire to just argue for the sake of arguing. It's like I can't disengage or stop.. but I force myself ot anyway. I pointed out some of the times when I experience executive dysfunction and honestly just can not do something and how that looks and feels. I know my ex husband used to complain that he didn't feel heard by me. And some of the things I did, would drive him crazy. I didn't understand until after we split up and I read this book and read the experience of another ADHD wife and the comments her husband made that were in Melissa's book. It was a mirror reflected back at me.
Anyway, her comment about how most relationships suffer similar problems got me to thinking. And I do think ADHD is underdiagnosed for sure. I think that most marriages will break down if couples aren't working on communicating or putting in an effort to actively spend time together. And I do think that it can be easy the longer you have been together, to fall into that trap of comfort and not notice when two people are drifting or starting to do minor things that are going to harm the relationship over time if done repeatedly. But I still don't think she's right. I've had a hard time trying to explain to her just what ADHD is. And I think if anything, she is seeing things about her reflected back to her that she doesn't necessarily want to confront. And that's ok. But I've got ADHD, my partner does, and all of my kids do. And it looks different for each one of us. And to just tell me "everyone learns and thinks differently, why do they need a label"? Is not helpful.
The Dr that diagnosed me, has ADHD. My natuorpath has ADHD. My hairdresser has ADHD. My partner's psychologist has ADHD. The majority of my friend's circle has ADHD. And I'm not talking about people who have taken an online quiz and decided they have it. I'm talking about people who have sought out and received a medical diagnosis for it from either a doctor or psychologist. And while I am aware that I tend to gravitate more toward people with brains similar to mine, it still seems like a large amount of people that I happen to know have ADHD. I'm also in an ADHD support group and there are a ton of people in there that are coming to terms with having ADHD after being diagnosed much later in life and how it's a lightbulb moment for them sometimes.
And so I think we are starting to understand it better, we are starting to diagnose people more frequently. But I think there are a lot of people out there not diagnosed because their traits are maybe not as serious compared to others that have more severe ADHD. Or they just get labeled as lazy, etc. and they either live with that label or get misdiagnosed with something else entirely. I was told for years that I had anxiety, and that never really "clicked" for me and when I was taking anxiety medication, I noticed some of my ADHD traits became more pronounced because I was maybe not feeling anxiety anymore, but I couldn't remember where I left things for the life of me, I was constantly late for things and I couldn't sit still. Some of the marriages that I have seen break down around me, I wouldn't be shocked to learn that one of the partners had ADHD. For others who have had similar issues, I think it's just an issue of a communication breakdown or something. But it is an interesting observation and this is the kind of thing I find myself thinking about sometimes.
So yes, I think ADHD is underdiagnosed. And yes, that pattern you are noticing, I wouldn't be surprised if some of them do have a partner with ADHD. But maybe not all of them.
I'll second that Beyond Confused
Submitted by J on
Much of what you've said I've thought of myself at different times. I can only add my own thoughts in addition.
From everything I learned so far, since I was first diagnosed ( about 20 years ago ). I'm more than a little confident in saying that ADHD is only part of the story. It always comes with other things. I actually thought I had OCD ( which I do or at least...components if not fully diagnosable ) I actually read online, a list of things commonly associated with OCD and one of them was ADHD. I then looked that up and went...wow, I think I have ADHD? Little did I know...that was only the tip of the iceberg. The whole notion of insecure attachments, personality disorders, mood disorder and a host of other things that were outside of my awareness were literally invisible to me. And that's why, getting therapy was so valuable to me. It showed me, not only which thing applied or didn't apply to me...it taught me how to do something about them by myself, without having to have someone else do things for me in regard to my emotional and mental health.
It also showed me how well I was able to figure a lot of these things by myself...before I was diagnosed. And actually...I think I did pretty well all things considered without saying...there were a huge number left for me to deal with. Another way to say this ....the symptoms I had that presented themselves to me and I was aware of, I learned a number of different strategies that actually worked that were not detrimental and healthy alternatives. It's not that I didn't have those particular symptoms...I just figured out a way to manage them successfully without medication and therapy.
I would never suggest someone go the route I did but....not knowing you have a disorder and all you want is to be is "normal ", forces you to learn to sink or swim in that same effort. I didn't know any better? I thought I was "normal " like everyone else? Not knowing, lends itself to not being a victim and not using ADHD as an excuse... if you don't even know what ADHD is ?
Knowing you do have a disorder (or ADHD) can also be self limiting. If you actually ARE using it as an excuse, playing a victim role, then you can always say: "I can't" ..rather than "I can." ( negative or positive )
It's a double edged sword I guess?
PS I remember the marriage counselor I had ( also my therapist ) said about my ex wife: "somewhere along the line, she learned that being a victim worked to get things she wanted". That's a quote...or as close as I can to remembering it.