For the past few months, I have tried a new tactic. As soon as H would start yelling, I would leave and not come back for a day or two.
For awhile, H would just get angrier and more verbally threatening, this is what is called an Extinction Burst. When the Non sets a Boundary, the mentally-unhealthy person will "kick it up a notch" hoping that you'll give up your boundary. I held firm.
Every few days, H would start yelling at me about an incident that happened 4 years ago between him and our son. Our son hasn't spoken to him since. Since H couldn't "get at him," I became the target for his anger. I was also the target for his anger about his job, his relatives, and anything else that upset him.
the anger about the incident with our son caused him to file for divorce from me TWICE, cost us thousand and thousands and thousands of dollars. I kept telling him that if he wanted to stay with me, then he had to stop bringing that subject up. He wouldn't stop. Every few days, he'd erupt, he'd drink, he'd rage.
So, a few months ago, I started leaving the moment any negativity started. I kept my purse/phone/iPad near me at all times. I kept some clothing and toiletries in my car.....and the moment he'd start, I'd leave. He'd call me, but I wouldn't answer. Often, I'd block his number.
As Extinction Bursts go, he was a classic case. He got angrier and angrier. He made all kinds of threats. I held to my guns.
He complained to his T, and she wasn't on his side. She told him that he was a whiner, a drama queen, and a drunk. she was brutal. And, she fired him as a client. She said other things, but H hasn't yet told me all that she said. Some things, I think, are just too painful. Likely, she told him that he has a Personality Disorder and, as such, would be impossible to live with no matter how saintly I was.
So....Finally, about 3 weeks ago, H surrendered. He simply said, "I have to stop. I can't bring up the incident with our son anymore. I hate it when you leave. I'm a mess when you leave. I can't yell at you anymore." While I was glad to hear that, I didn't know how long it would last. Other times where he would say that he wanted the marriage to be better, he'd fall back to his yelling ways rather quickly.
So far, so good. He hasn't yelled at me once. the one time he was annoyed at something, I held my ground, and he later came and apologized. He never yelled.. I just disagreed with him, told him my side, and he accepted it. This is very new for him.
He seems to accept that he has something seriously wrong with him...this is new. In the past, he would make claims like that other husband described in this forum. H used to claim to be the perfect husband and father, when in truth, he was horrible. yes, there were many times that he was great with our kids, but the problem is that kids REMEMBER the periodic times when parents are HORRIBLE...and that's what they remember.
I don't know how long this will last. It's been a wonderful change.
Self-awareness:)
Submitted by c ur self on
It's the road to healing!...I'm glad to hear it's been more peaceful for you guy's
Blessings C
Anger
Submitted by Strawberries@3 on
Glad to hear he has decided to work on his anger. I wish you the best of luck.
I am new to this forum and have been reading people's experience with ADHD. I have been with my spouse for over 20 years and married over 15 years and have 2 children. He has ADHD and he knows it, but won't get treatment because he refuses to take meds. He also doesn't want to go to behavioral therapy. He doesn't believe they can help him. All they will say is to keep his mouth shut and take meds. He said he has been living with all of his life and I nor anyone can change it. In other words he is doing just fine living with it. I guess everyone else around him doesn't matter! He has never come out and told me he had it. It was not until this year that I finally pinpointed what was wrong with my H. He has always been short tempered and over interprets every situation. He acts very recklessly at times and can become very overwhelmed in crowds or when he needs to focus on something. I never knew what I was going to get when he walked in the door. He has had alcohol and substance abuse issues in the past. He has said he will quit drinking many times after going out of control and making me want to leave him. He has hurt me and many other people including his family, my family and his children verbally and still today he thinks it is OK again to just have a couple of drinks. After all he has it under control; again? I feel cheated and manipulated....There have been many times when I just wanted to leave and end it all. I believe the only reason I stay is because of the kids. I feel it will break their heart and ruin their childhood. I came close once to leaving him and I saw what it did to the kids. They told me they didn't want us to divorce. The guilt would kill me...They love him soo much and H is really good with them when he is focused on them. Of course, when they do something that makes him angry he snaps. I'm the one that always tries to defuse the situation and protect them. I don't understand why something so small as spilled milk could seem like the end of the world for him. I have tried many, many times to rationalize with him and make him see that it really isn't' worth getting angry about. He doesn't see it or sees it momentarily and diverts back to the old angry when the next incident occurs. I remember how attentive he was when we were dating. Now, I can't get him to listen to what I say. I have to repeat myself 2-3 times before he responds. I don't see how this could work, he doesn't want help and he won't accept his behavior is an issue. He believes I over react and make a big deal out of nothing....(I was just angry, get over it). I'm at the end of my rope & don't know what to do; I am torn! I am trying to read up on it to see if I can find a way to cope at least until my youngest goes to college. Not sure how much more I can take. Thank you for letting me vent.
I Hear Jennalemone
Submitted by kellyj on
All you can do at times is to try and just explain it away but that never seems to help. I think that's the biggest sign of my own denial.
J
Unfortuantely for Your Husband and You Strawberries @3
Submitted by kellyj on
Meds, treatment and behavioral therapy are the only things that helped me and they absolutely help. Without them, I could not have done anything by myself and believe me....I tried everything first with very little results to show for it. Meds alone will not work and it sounds like he has already come to that conclusion for himself because it's true. In that much, and him feeling optimistic about anything working any better is probably why he thinks nothing else will work. He's only accurate in his own thinking up to that point. Is there any positive way you can help him get past this point in his thinking?
J
Don't Know
Submitted by Strawberries@3 on
I really don't know how.... We tried counseling before I knew this was the issue. He was abusing drugs and kept it from everyone including me & the counselor. The counselor suggested we separate or divorce and that did not sit well with him for obvious reasons. He called her so many offensive names, I can not say here. Every time we have an argument, I try and suggest going back to a different counselor. It does not go over very well. He will not even consider it. He is completely negative about the topic. He accuses me of overreacting and reading into all of his behaviors. I don't think he wants to admit he has an issue. He won't tell his family. Everyone just thinks he has a short fuse and is very blunt. I can tell they try not to spend too much time with him. He always complains about how his family will not call and invite him anywhere. I've told him, it might be because he is very blunt and they take offense to that. He remains in denial and says they are overly sensitive.... He does not get it. He acts like a spoiled teenager and drives me and the kids crazy at times. He finds it funny to make fun of people. Completely takes it overboard. Usually until someone gets their feelings hurt. Including himself, if anyone says something that hurts him. I feel like I have 3 children...Any suggestions on how to get him to change his thinking in a positive way?
Drugs are a Crutch
Submitted by kellyj on
If he is hiding it, he's protecting it in fear of losing it.....his means to self medicate for the pain and fear he is experiencing between the two of you (losing you?) My guess is he's still using and if he hasn't changed he still is and just hiding it from you. Maybe? Calling the councilor offensive names when she suggested separation or divorce shows you that's not what he wants. He's afraid...be there for him and make sure he knows you are there and not going to leave him....the drugs are just filling the hole where he needs you to be. If he can't respond to you and you have done everything else then you councilor may be right...for your sake not his. I think for someone like this however, the mistake to make is to make it about the drugs. The ultimatum shouldn't be about the drug use....it's about you and how he treat's you. If you focus on the drugs it will only make him more afraid of losing you and them at the same time. (his means of emotional survival and stability) This will not get you what you or him if you really want to stay together. If you aren't sure of that yourself....I'd make sure of that first or else that might be the reason he is acting the way he is. He thinks you might leave and he senses it that from your behaviors? Maybe? Focus on him not all of his behaviors(not taking care of him, taking care of his emotions instead...let the other behaviors go for now and look past those things to what he really wants....to be with you and for you to love him. Show him affection and do things in positive ways that keep telling him the same thing over and over and see if that helps. I started doing this with my wife and the response was an almost immediately positive change overnight. Reassurance might be the best medicine for you to use with him and he might be able to put the other ones away once he has that from you. If he's addicted and can't do this alone he will need help from another source.
J
I don't think he uses any
Submitted by Strawberries@3 on
I don't think he uses any longer; gets tested for his job and would loose it if that was the case. He also does not exhibit the same behaviors I saw when he was using. I always fear he may go back to using when we argue. I've tried being positive towards him and he gets annoyed or thinks I'm up to something. Don't know what I could be up to if I only want to talk it out. He demands affection and I am not always willing to give it, given all the anger and frustration that builds up from the many things he does that upset me. I don't understand how he can do something and within an hour he has completely forgotten about it and no longer wants to talk about it. Like it never happened, and I just want to keep picking at it according to him. These days I just try and keep the peace and concentrate on raising my children. I don't know what is going to happen when they grow up. No reason to stay if the situation doesn't change. We even like different things. I believe when we were dating, he only pretended to like what I liked. Now it's all about what he wants to do. If I don't want to do what he wants to do; I'm only being difficult or think "I'm too good", to do whatever. Constantly uses the kids to convince me to go where he wants to go as a "family".
That Must Be Frustrating
Submitted by kellyj on
The only advise I can offer is to keep encouraging therapy for both of you. I couldn't do without it and like I said before....I had to have it in order to change. Behavioral therapy is really what he needs not just couples counseling. My ex wife and I had to go through 2 different tries with different therapists to find the right one and I was ready to give up at that point. I'm thankful now I did not give up. My ex and I parted ways for a number of reasons but the therapy I continued with is exactly what made the difference for me. The third therapist we found back then....is the same one I've been seeing for over ten years but it took some time to learn to trust him even then.
As far as liking different things, I can tell you that a big mistake I made in my past was believing that the person I was with needed to like the things I did and do them with me. He might have been doing things you liked back then because he wanted to be with you and was trying to share the same interests with you. That can only be seen as a compliment to you in my eyes. He still may have had other things he liked to do more but was trying to please you at the time yet not ever wanting to completely stop doing or never doing other things that he enjoyed too....or doing things that he's dreamed of doing and really wants to try them but hasn't had the chance. You can't fault a person for liking other things than you do but it's not fair (selfish) to not allow you to seek those things yourself or insist that you do things that he likes even if you don't. The failure on his part was not speaking up in the first place and again...not saying this to you now. He may be afraid to assert himself in fear of saying what he really wants and that you might reject him for saying it. If there are consequences for simply saying how you feel or disagreeing with someone you are likely not going to risk that again after a while and just stop saying anything at all and just doing it anyway. Again...it's all about fear.
PS ....using your kids as leverage instead of telling you what he really wants of feels is just another indicator of what I just said...different symptom, same problem. It may look and feel like he is pushing you away, but it comes from fear of rejection. I would target that fear and do the positive things that will only reassure that you will not reject him or leave despite what his behaviors are telling you to the opposite. I hope this helps?
J
So sorry that you're dealing with this...
Submitted by overwhelmedwife on
As for him refusing to see a T.....
Many T's will refuse to see/treat active alcoholics. One reason that my H's T fired him was because he had let her think that he wasn't drinking anymore and that he was going to AA meetings 3+ times per week. When she found out that he was still drinking ( a lot ) and that he never went to more than 4 AA meetings total in the past 12 months, she fired him as a client/patient.
Your H may be aware of such a req't.
>>>
He has always been short tempered and
>>>>>
What does he do/say when he loses his temper, and what are the after-effects?
>>>
over interprets every situation.
>>>>
^^ This is very interesting. What does he do? When I read your words, a lightbulbe went on in my head. H does THAT, too....I just never heard it worded that way, "over interprets"....that is such a good descriptor.
Copping
Submitted by Strawberries@3 on
He no longer drinks like he used to. He will have a beer or two on occasion; buts that's all. He knows how I feel about it and so far respects it. Thank goodness! I think my biggest issue is the anger and not being able to understand why minor things at times make him very angry. The screaming at the top of his voice is what angriest me the most. When I say he over interprets every situation; is that he reads into it and thinks negative as his first response. I'd wish he would see a behavioral therapist. I know that would truly help. Good luck to you.
<<<When I say he over
Submitted by overwhelmedwife on
<<<When I say he over interprets every situation; is that he reads into it and thinks negative as his first response. <<<
Yes!!! But I don't think that is ADHD. I think that is something else. paranoia? Insecurity? low self esteen?
I can't tell you how many times H will jump to the wrong conclusion and "over interprets" a situation. When the kids were younger, we had a "study room" for them to do their homework. It was also where the computers were (before the popularity of laptops).
The kids would sometimes leave behind some snack wrappers. Instead of realizing that the boys were being messy and just needed to be told, "get back in there and clean up your mess," H would say, " They leave the mess because they don't want me to use the computers." Uh, no....they're teenagers and they're being lazy. They aren't thinking about you. You are the last thing on their minds. They did their homework, left behind some snack wrappers, and are now watching TV. They aren't thinking, "Let's leave behind snack wrappers and Coke cans so dad won't want to use the computers." lol
This sort of over-interpreting will go on with the most silly things. the electric company is working on some issues on our street. They have had to dig up some areas. H is taking it all PERSONALLY...lol. Oh my.
I can't tell you how many times he has jumped to the wrong conclusion (always a very negative conclusion) about something I've done. He'll attach all these accusations and crazy thoughts to the most innocent actions.
What I see concerning this and have also experienced....
Submitted by c ur self on
(Yes!!! But I don't think that is ADHD. I think that is something else. paranoia? Insecurity? low self esteem?)
Common behaviors that follow Add/Adhd, unhealthy child hoods, learning disabilities and other types of trauma. i.e..(abandonment, sexual molestation etc...
Inferiority Complex- intense feeling of inferiority, producing a personality characterized either by extreme reticence or, as a result of overcompensation, by extreme aggressiveness. lack of self-esteem; feeling of inadequacy; lack of self-confidence.
Over compensation-a pronounced striving to neutralize and conceal a strong but unacceptable character trait by substituting for it an opposite trait.
Thank you! ....and adding to the above.....
Submitted by overwhelmedwife on
H has a disorder that has a symptom that is common to some other disorders.... He has a need to label people/incidents and put them into "good categories" and "bad categories"....right away. He'll dislike someone right away based on...well....nothing....well some tiny thing that isn't worth disliking someone.
H has to put incidents/places/people into black and white categories. Painting someone of something black put them into the bad category.
I've Seen This Too C
Submitted by kellyj on
Along with those features you also get persecution delusions, superior attitudes that far exceed the persons capabilities and weird out of context personal declarations..."I am (what ever)". My favorite George Carlin bit.." I am Fuck...Fuck of the Mountain!!" Yes....so true and just as bizarre. The person I am familiar with also had a very skewed religious and political belief system revolving around Christianity. He saw himself as Jesus and even emulated this persona by even wearing sandals in the middle of winter and had a ranking (labeling system) for Christians... "baby"Christian (infant), Christian and then of course himself? Where else can you go past disciple? He wanted only to be referred to as "Thomas" and did not like it when you called him Tom even though his own family called him by that name? He saw himself as a teacher even though he was terrible at teaching. This gentleman is someone I worked with (I was his foreman) and when he was first hired on he referred to himself as "Master". This is a very specific definition in my field of work and even though he took the proficiency test and failed...he stilled maintained that he was a "Master". Are you seeing the connection here?
I use to joke with him to get him in an effort to step down by calling him "Master-baiter" because he was also obsessed with fishing. (again the connection) His head (his bald spot) would turn bright red when I said this and he was extremely toxic to the work environment. He would not take orders or defer to anyone and would slip many times and give me directions (you need to do XXX) even though he was my subordinate. When I would say "thank you for your permission to do (what ever)" his bald spot would turn bright red again. He was finally fired for insubordination by my employer when he refused to do what he was told on the grounds that it went against his ethical moral code even though he himself would do the very same thing for the same reason and see nothing wrong with it.
He would give you a gift (food, chocolates) then later accuse you of being selfish for not doing the same thing for him which was not a practice where I worked to hand out sweets to each other. He was the only one I worked with in 25 years who brought candy in to share. He was complaining, short tempered and vindictive and was as far from a good example of a Christian as anyone one I ever met. He also could not refer to himself or anyone else without attaching a label to it. I am this....you are that. I use to ask him "person, place or thing?" This would make his bald spot red again. I always know when he was angry when this happened even though he never knew this since he could not see the top of his head. I wish I had played poker with him....if only? lol
PS....not without saying, he did not have ADHD