Note: I wanted to get my husbands permission before posting so he didn't feel like I was going behind his back. Italicized sentences are things he wanted me to add
I've been hoping for couples therapy for a long time. We both thought it would be helpful but weren't feeling like we could afford it. We have made some big adjustments but something that continues to be really hard are these moments where we have REALLY different ways of thinking/seeing things. Sometimes that's a perceived hurt like he'll say something that's just really really hurtful, something I feel sure I'm not crazy for being offended at and I just feel like I HAVE to get him to see how/why it was hurtful. Other times it's different ideas for how to tackle a problem and doing it his way just doesn't make sense. Sometimes I feel like his ideas might have an impact on or be dangerous to our kids.
The event that drove me to seek out a couples therapist was a few weeks ago. I was on a trip to visit my sister. My husband is very very into running. He runs 10 miles every day and can be inflexible about it. before I left we talked about options for running with kids (gym with childcare, expensive running stroller, taking the older kids to their sports camp so he could use the single stroller, etc). He called that first night and said that while he'd run on the treadmill at the gym he wanted to mix it up. His plan for the next morning was to load up our kids (aged 10-ADHD, 7-ADHD, and 2) at 4:30 am and drive over to a sort of remote location (about 2 miles from our house but not near any residences) on BLM land and park near a hill. He planned to leave the kids in the car with the windows down for 60 minutes while he did hill repeats on this hill. Something else to note is that we live in Arizona, and it's hot here all day and all night. It turned out that it was between 70-79 degrees at the time of the workout according to my husband but for me that was one of the things I worried about upon hearing the plan. *He wants me to add that the hill was only 133 meters long...no wait he is google earthing it and it's 80 meters long...this information was not presented to me at the time
I immediately felt this huge pressure to convince him not to go through with this plan. To me there were risks that weren't worth taking, especially when there were other options for running. I said "You can not do that honey you just can not do that". He asked why"?" I told him there's risks. He asked "like what?" I said, well if you're not seeing the kids just the car they could be fighting in there, messing with the vehicle, getting out and walking away, (our 7 year old has a history of eloping at school, and last time I parked in front of the atm for 5 minutes she got out and was about to go wandering but I was watching her and called her over-husband wants me to add that he has never seen her elope out of a car and she would be fine if she had an ipad) if someone came by and felt like things were off they could call cops or authorities..." He got upset and said I don't trust him and hung up on me, I felt very sure that this plan was objectively unsafe but I also realized in that moment that a lot of our fights happen when I try to make a logical argument to convince him to see things my way. Instead of doing that I just said "Your plan is unsafe please don't do that". He came up with an alternative (taking them at 5 am to the park and putting them in strollers while running laps around park) he kept asking why the initial plan was unsafe and I said I didn't want to get into an argument about it, I texted "to me it seems really straightforward that this plan is unsafe and I'm not sure how to get on the same page about that without an argument". I felt like I had identified an issue to work on in therapy: In order to avoid getting upset in arguments, I need to avoid trying to convince him to see things the way I do, but how do I approach scenarios where I really feel like there is a safety issue and that it's important to get on the same page? So I made an appointment.
Yesterday was our first therapy appointment with this new therapist. During our appointment I told this story. For context, the very first thing my husband said was that I am happy when I get my way and that when I don't get my way that's when we have problems. I told the story. She said it's not fair for me to ask for his help but to expect him to do it my way. She said that it should default to whichever adult is watching the kids. She asked why I don't trust him. I felt so on the spot and so surprised by this idea that I'm not allowed to be concerned about my kids safety in this instance. She said well you have a choice either you can let him do it his way or do it yourself. I said "well my initial reaction to that is 'ok well then I guess that means I can't go out of town'" she said well "why don't you trust him?" She asked what evidence I have that I can't trust him with my kids. I said I do trust him with my kids I left for a 5 day trip without hesitation, but I DON'T trust this particular plan he had. She said I can't dictate how he does things and that not trusting him is questioning his character. We moved on to talking about chores and this idea that I'm super controlling seemed to prevail. (He wants me to include the entire context for this, I had wanted to make this more brief) I don't feel like my husband was asked to challenge his thinking much. She also hinted that while I had mentioned his adhd impacted our marriage, that it might not be having as much of an impact as I say. I felt so strange and ultimately incredible helpless after the appointment. I don't think I'm a controlling person. We had a little bit of parent/child dynamics going on that I've been working on since taking the seminar. Who I am as a person though is not at all type A, things have to be my way. I came in willing to work on myself but I just thought couples therapy would be we would both have work to do. My private feelings are that maybe she doesn't know what an adhd marriage looks like? It's really hard to articulate the consistent little things that add up to really struggling. I also wonder if I didn't do a good job advocating for myself. I was trying to be very aware of my language make sure I only spoke to my own feelings and not put words in his mouth, while he was being a lot more direct. My husband feels that the appointment went great and that she was really fair and that I'm just upset because I don't want to have to change.
This is striking a huge chord with me and making me so so sad.I feel like this happens often in our marriage where I earnestly want to make changes for the better and I'm willing to do that...and then he sees it in a completely different way. I don't want to be someone who won't take a therapists advice or who won't listen or change but I also feel like feeling so distraught after and so hopeless is not how it's supposed to feel? How do I know if my therapy experience was not ideal vs me just not being willing to see my own flaws?
*Posted with my husbands permission and with his corrections
Your children, your good judgement
Submitted by Swedish coast on
I disagree with this therapist. No one I know would approve of your husband's plan of tearing small children out of bed in wee hours to leave them in the car. Any parent I know would instead ask a friend to babysit for an hour if they were really addicted to their running. And most parents I know wouldn't prioritize their running over their children or their partner's need to have a few days off once in a while.
Even if there weren't any acute safety issues involved, it's just a strange plan that would be frowned upon in my context.
That's unacceptable
Submitted by 1Melody1 on
I'm sorry but his plan for the children was 100% unacceptable. That's not at all safe or reasonable. It's a selfish decision.
It sounds like his drive to run is so strong that absolutely everything else must bend to accommodate it. Who cares if four other people are negatively affected as long as he gets his fix?? To disrupt the children by dragging them out in the heat at that hour is ridiculous. They are much too young to be left in a car at a distance even without the heat. He wants strollers and iPads to do his parenting for him so he can have his hobby and that's not the way adult life works. He has three children that he had equal part in bringing into the world. They come first. Running must work around parenting, not the other way around.
I highly recommend seeking out another therapist. Perhaps this one doesn't have children and can not understand the life and death responsibility of parenting. Regardless, she does NOT understand the debilitating impact of ADHD on the whole family. Her minimizing that isn't going to help you in any way.
Please just know that your barometer for reasonable is NOT off here.
Barometer for resonable is a great way to put it
Submitted by Luvs2Run on
That's really validating. As much as I want to be better about accepting that there's more than one way to look at things I think having my barometer for reasonable challenged is a huge part of what feels so awful. It's a huge trigger that makes me feel crazy and so angry when I know that my perspective is reasonable and my husband claims I'm being unreasonable. I think that's why having the therapist sort of invalidate that reasonablity really felt terrible. It's like...ok I already have to ask myself "Am I being crazy" a ton and now I'm having to ask myself "but really am I crazy" after a therapy appointment just about did me in
You are not crazy
Submitted by Swedish coast on
I agree with Melody. Get rid of the therapist.
I know who I'd choose in this case to take care of children and it's neither your husband nor the therapist.
All the best to you.
Your own therapist?
Submitted by 1Melody1 on
I think being in relationships like this can make us feel crazy and make us question ourselves. But our gut knows when things aren't right. If you struggle finding a right-fit couples therapist right away I wonder if getting your own therapist might help in the meantime. When I first went to therapy myself it felt so good to be heard and validated. Finally someone validated that certain dynamics and behaviours were not okay and didn't try to make me shoulder blame I shouldn't or demand I continue to change/betray myself to accommodate unacceptable behaviour. It was a huge shift for me to have a person on my side invested in my wellbeing for once.
I'm sorry this negative experience with the therapist happened to you.
I also agree with Melody.
Submitted by AdeleS6845 on
Getting your own therapist will really help along with getting a different couples therapist.
I experienced something similar when going to couples therapy with my ex-husband.
I didn't know it at the time, but the therapist that he picked out for us to go to as a couple had been his therapist for months. She only knew his side of the story. She took his side immediately, labeling me an "angry person", after only hearing me speak for 5 minutes. That was the first and only session with that therapist.
Grossly unprofessional
Submitted by Swedish coast on
It's unethical for a therapist to do couples therapy and also see one of the partners in individual therapy. Siding with one person in therapy is also unprofessional. Both things are entirely unacceptable to licensed professionals in my country.
Even as our couples therapist saw our problem clearly (my husband's illness) she would never put cheap labels on either of us, and never dismiss any person's feelings and perspective.
Im sorry you've had these experiences with therapy.
Terrifying
Submitted by Catterfly on
You seem like a very empathic person. You clearly love your husband and are concerned about honouring his feelings. Even the time you took to brainstorm safe running options is evidence of that.
On the flip side, your husband hasn't been able to put himself into the mind of a toddler that wakes up and finds themselves locked in the back of a vehicle with their siblings. That alone could be very very frightening to a child.
It's so disappointing that your therapist didn't validate your feelings and put you in an even worse position. I agree that you need to find a new person!