I sometimes wonder how I got into this situation with H. How did I eventually let my guard down so much that I daily, weekly, monthly, yearly, decadely permit myself to be regretful and confused?
I am deconstructing our conversations to find clues and here is one. This just happened:
Me: With a positive tone, "I like to stand on this rug"...(it is nubbly textured on stocking feet).
H: With an argumentative tone, "You can't stand on that rug. It isn't your rug."
I walk away. flummoxed. again. OK, let's give H a benefit of the doubt that what he said was said to be cute and sassy rather than to really want to throw verbal darts at me. Over decades of his little sassy "put-downs" it has worn on my own knee-jerk reactions to make it feel like another tiny gut-punch. So, I am trying to positively change my self. How could I have responded? I DO NOT want to have the relationship with H that is filled with sassy comebacks and jovial sparring constantly like it seems he wants our relationship to be. To me that is not an intimate relationship but is sophomoric. His humor is baser than mine and is mostly sarcasm and inane teasing rather than witty repertoire ....and I really don't know if he was joking anyway. Let's see some different scenarios than me walking away feeling gut-punched....
Me: "I like to stand on this rug"
H: "You can't stand on that rug. It isn't your rug."
Me: "What do you mean, it isn't my rug?"
This would start a verbal argument about where the rug came from. Why it isn't my rug to stand on. Me saying I have a right to stand on all the rugs in the house...yada, yada. Another verbal sparring that H seemed to want to have and I fell for it.
Me: "I like to stand on this rug."
H: You can't stand on that rug. It isn't your rug."
Me: Picking up the scatter rug, rolling it in a ball and throwing it at him, "Shut up!" walking away.
Hmm....I wonder. That is what I do in my own head. Maybe I should really "act out" rather than stuff my emotions and feel like I have been bullied. This response so far feels like a better way to respond than just walking away feeling confused and sniped at. Because I have to respond differently than I have been.
Or
Me: "I like to stand on this rug."
H: You can't stand on that rug. It isn't your rug."
Me: "Hmmmmm?" Slowing looking at him. Watching him. What is his face saying to me? Wait for more words to follow.
H: (I will have to guess from previous similar occasions) Not looking at me. Walking out of the room with a gait of "Heh. Got her!"
Me: following him. "Yikes! Don't sit on that chair. It's not your chair!"
This would either start another fight or laughter depending on the mood HE is in. My joining in on his "verbal darts" game does not guarantee a playful game.
Here is the conclusion for me. We are not comfortably, emotionally intimate so it is not safe for either of us to speak with vulnerability. He has constantly bullied me (always with a ha ha at the end). All I can do is IN MY OWN HEAD accept that this is the way he is. My come back is to walk away and say to MYSELF, "We are two cranky people here. Acceptance. But I don't have to be cranky anymore. I am going to take myself and the dog to Starbucks and see some friendly people's faces."
Anybody have some thoughts on "how to respond differently"? How to adjust our own emotions and perspectives so that we can have these little conversations without disgust or self pity? I am trying to change my responses. Until I feel trust with someone who I can be interdependent with, I must respond as an independent.
It’s stimulation for him. His
Submitted by Hopeful Heart on
It’s stimulation for him. His brain needs the stimulation and he’s using you as his adhd punching bag.
On days that my husband works at his high stress, mentally demanding job, he’s very pleasant. During his down time, if he gets to participate in competitive sports or drive an atv at high speeds or shoot a gun, etc. then he’s fine to be around. However, if we have an opportunity to have a quiet weekend at home, he gets nasty. He ostracizes me. He talks to me like I don’t have a brain in my head. It doesn’t matter what opinion I have, he automatically sticks his nose in the air and takes the opposite opinion. It’s a compulsion. He doesn’t even know he’s doing it. He needs the stimulation and he’s using me as his adhd punching bag. I’ve made him aware of it and he’s trying to find other ways to deal with his adhd.
I don’t know what an appropriate response would be. Especially when it’s all so irrational. I would encourage you to pay attention to when it’s happening. Maybe if he’s aware of it, he can find another outlet.
Im sorry you’re going through this.
Being mean is stimulation for him
Submitted by jennalemone on
Hopeful Heart, YES!!! You are right and I had not thought of it like that. It has gotten so much worse now that H is mostly retired. From the beginning, H would take it out on me if he had frustrations from work. I accepted that. (btw..I would not accept that now that I know better.)" No matter what opinion I have, he automatically sticks his nose in the air and takes the opposite opinion". Yes, that happens ALL the time. It is lack of respect for me (and for you). Today I have been Googling articles on "respect". I know that when I was a young married I was told by "my" religion, and also 20th century culture, to serve and obey a husband. That was so WRONG to do but I thought I had to...you know....sin and hell and all that. Well, it really backfired on me. H has had NO RESPECT for me. How would I feel if I had a husband who thought he had to serve and obey me? I probably wouldn't respect him much either. Anyway, I am trying to bolster my stance as somebody who deserves respect. I really didn't use to think respect was a big deal....I thought "love" would take care of respect. It didn't. I am working on self respect and to learn how to teach people to treat me with some respect.
This is exactly what happens
Submitted by Libby on
This is exactly what happens at my house. Weekends are literally hell here. He cannot tolerate what her perceives as boredom. It's nasty times from Friday evening until Monday morning. And it is just as irrational for me to feel responsible for his mad boredom.
I agree w/ Libby...
Submitted by c ur self on
Butt hole comments must be ignored....Sarcasm should never be responded to....He feeds off the reply...If you don't know what to say in those moments, that is telling you something...No reply and your the winner...
Jenna...Oh, this rug feels so good to stand on in stocking feet....
Husband....You can't stand on that rug, it's not your rug...
Jenna....Keeps moving around and moaning w/ pleasure as she relaxes her mind and feet;)
Jenna..walking away, that really does feel good, you should try it....
Husband...Thinking silently in his mind (She didn't pay an ounce of attention to me..I must be slipping, I can usually get her going w/ my sarcastic comments)...That is his way of establishing dominance...Get you to respond to his sarcasm...Which he has mastered, so you lose every time...The only way for him to lose, is for you to recognize his game, and not play...By not replying to his sarcasm, he's not dominate any longer...He want like your new ability to ignore his sarcasm, because he knows it puts you on level ground with him....You will have mastered what he can't do.....
c
That’s a great way to think
Submitted by Hopeful Heart on
That’s a great way to think about it, but I seriously doubt that the attacks will stop if they are ignored, at least not at my house. I’ve been ignoring them for over two decades and they haven’t stopped. They’ve just become more irrational with age. It’s exhausting to live in a state of defensiveness. Wondering when the next attack will come. That’s a terrible quality of life. For me, I need to deal with it and improve the situation or move on to better things.
May the force be with you
Submitted by jennalemone on
Trying to be "above" the fray and taking it on the chin is not working. Ignoring the chain pulling me down is not working. I must be strong enough mentally to remove the chains and stop the onslaughts. It seems I have been "played" easily because of my want to serve and obey. I guess I thought I would be rewarded with love and appreciation. But I was wrong. I sacrificed for nothing. As you say, C, "It's exhausting to live in a state of defensiveness". Today I am focusing on ways to have my own integrity and self respect back again. I Googled "How to deal with manipulative people" and am finding lots to switch my perspective from "good girl praying for the best" and on towards maturity and strong person-hood. Hope to practice some Jedi mind tricks of my own to counter H's manipulative offenses. This is not what I thought marriage would be like - skirmishes & battle plans. But sometimes life teaches you things and you must accept them, name them and stand up or be crushed. I am trying to respond differently.
I agree w/ you also Hopeful H....long term...
Submitted by c ur self on
But, in the moment, we can get to comfortable...We think we are looking at someone who cares, ( we want it so bad) and we let our guard down....When dealing w/ someone w/ a potty mouth, and no respect, we shouldn't allow ourselves not to view them as anything but, what they most always prove to be..The serpent who is always ready to strick, not our life mate that has our best interest at heart.....If all of sudden I forget my spouse has been driven for 10 years by selfish motivation only, in our relationship, it bites me...If a husband or wife has to be run behind and told they should be open, approachable, and that they should do the work in the home, and in the relationship, that's a problem....It's a much bigger problem for those of us, living abandoned, but insist on running behind a non-caring spouse....Who if you press them will just continue to hurt ur feelings and again show their true colors...
Yes, living long term w/ someone who only wants to use us to get their selfish needs meet, and then retreats to their independent selfish, and unapproachable mindset.....Should not be viewed as someone to attempt to communicate w/ long term...But until we deal with it on some kind of permanent basis, we shouldn't allow ourselves to forget the attacks, when we just ask them to honor their vows, and start doing the work in the marriage....If they haven't yet, it's a very good chance all we are going to get is our feelings hurt again...
Blessings
c
“You will know (good from bad) when you are calm, at peace".
Submitted by jennalemone on
C, Looks like we are on the same page this morning. We seem to be in situations where we must be constantly aware of their offense/defense game and not comfortably let our guards down too often with our spouses. I am schooling myself on emotional strength training today.
“Train yourself to let go of everything you fear to lose.” Yoda
Jenna what are we dealing with?
Submitted by c ur self on
(IMO) We are dealing with the Spirit that moves them....(Their view of where they think life comes from)...What ever man perceives as good and evil, is always faulty (when left to his own devices) and will always produce acts of self preservation (prolonging of life, self enhancement) even at the expense of others (or I should say especially at the expense of others, because it takes others for them to prove their worth, their dominance)...If this spirit is trusted, (not brought into the light of truth) and allowed to guide me, it will always be destructive to my relationships...When I'm the center of my life, selfishness will always be my master...
Limits on how far a mind guided by carnal thinking (evil) will go, is only limited by knowledge of law, and fear of law....It will always be this way, because there is no power of righteousness or revelation of righteousness that can be produced with in the carnal mind....So justifying insults, sarcasm or anything else that causes them to feel good about themselves, becomes easy and natural....With out ears to hear, without a heart that feels conviction, there will be no repentance at a level that changes the heart and mind, to stop the individual from being their own God....
c
I agree, Hopeful Heart...
Submitted by AdeleS6845 on
When I took my counselors advice: "Do Not Engage " it didn't stop my ex husband's verbal attacks. I would calmly walk away, with no facial expression, but he'd follow me to the next room.
The only thing that worked for me after 17 years was divorce, I'm sad to say.
I feel the same
Submitted by pinkiemartini on
Hi! i am new in the forum and i have been 9 months with my partner living in the same house now ... and that is since day 1 that I realized how things were with him. And like you described ... in the beginning I tried to talk to him and "convince"him that he was wrong ... and well I learned that was not the way.
Then I decided to go along with what he was saying .... I was wrong again because then he interpretate as I was motivating him to do something wrong (which I was not)
Then I decided to not say anything at all .... I was wrong again because I was "ignoring" him even when I was not .. I put attention to everything he says but literally I have no words to say anything.
And then when I am in my room, he comes and has a verbal diarrea (and I remain silence) and then closes the door ... and then comes back again .. until he gets tired and lock himself in his own room.
I only have lived with him 9 months and it has been horrible. We worked so hard to get the visa (i am from Mexico and he lives in the Netherlands) that I assume and believed he was under control with ihs treatment because when we meet we didnt have the situations we have now ... And I feel so emotionally exhausted and I can't go through this anymore. I know I promised we will be together in sickness and in health .. but the thing is that he sometimes messes up his own medicines, do the things he knows are not good for him .. and dont even talk about my own adaptation process ... it is just too much ...
So I am thinking to go back to mexico for some months .. mainly because I dont want to feel alone anymore and because I told him with my open heart "i cant do this anymore if you dont change and focus on get better" ... but at the same it is sad. it is not what I wanted.
I think HH is correct
Submitted by Brindle on
If you think he will take it in and work on it, then I think you should point it out. That would be awesome if he’d hear it and work on it.
If you are sure he wouldn’t listen, or if you try and he doesn’t listen, then personally, I’d respond like this:
Jenna: love this rug
Jenna’s husband: not your rug
Jenna: (smiles a slight smile and has an air of not being disturbed, just a pleasant person) Hmm.
That’s the kind of thing I do. I give nothing. I see H look disappointed sometimes. He really wanted to get me stirred up. Oh well. I’m not playing that game. And if one of us is going to end up unhappy, it should be the guy trying to make trouble.
Exercise
Submitted by Hopeful Heart on
I’ve read many times that exercise is great for adhd. I think the benefits of exercise have to do with the endorphines/stimulation that the brain receives. My husband and I have tried our whole marriage to find an activity to do together, but it’s never worked out. He’s so extreme and it’s miserable for me to try to keep up with him. This summer we tried playing tennis together. We both enjoyed the aspect of getting outside, getting some fresh air, running around and getting some exercise. But we weren’t very well matched as tennis opponents. We ended up getting a tennis ball machine. We hit the ball together for a while as a warmup and then we take turns with the ball machine. He can set it to throw the balls at him fast and hard. I can set it for slow and easy. It probably sounds silly, but some people have treadmills for exercise. We have a tennis ball machine. It works for us. I also think it helps with the stimulation/aggression that you mention in this thread. Maybe he could find some kind of exercise or you could find something to do together.
Call him out
Submitted by Dagmar on
I can say that this actually worked for me. I started saying "I've been reading a lot about adhd, so I know you're picking at me for stimulation, but I won't put up with it."
He stopped, and only after I called him out a few times. I was amazed at how well it worked.
I am going to use this, Dagmar
Submitted by 1Melody1 on
I am going to try this one myself. I feel like I have tried everything else, from logic to engaging to no reaction (which is somewhat successful in frustrating him because he can't get his desired stimulation). However, nothing has reduced the frequency of attempts to get that "rise" out of me. I think I tiptoe around ADHD sometimes for fear of hurting his feelings, though he doesn't give any thought to hurting mine. While I would never say something like this about my daughter's anxiety for instance, she is working on herself in therapy so that would be unfair. My husband, however, adamantly refuses treatment and I think calling out the ADHD in this calm and even way is respectful, delineates a boundary, and places the accountability where it belongs all in one fell swoop. Thanks, Dagmar. Gonna try this over the next few weeks/months and see if it improves things.