I have been together with my partner for four years and it has been really difficult time. I am just now trying to figure out if I should continue. During good times my partner is very sweet and caring. He has supported me throughout therapy and also regularly does me small gestures. It is also really nice to talk to him and he is definitely brilliant in his own way. The problem is, I am very demotivated to stay in our relationship. It feels to me, that it is a constant struggle. Lets start with his anger outbursts and problems accepting criticism. He used to throw things at me, when he got mad and could tell me very mean things. He has stopped doing this now, but I am not really trusting him completely in this regard. He also seems to have some issue with feeling easily disrespected. Small instance such as me asking him to take out the garbage can seem to him disrespectful because I am not doing these on my own. To continue, I do not even dare to go on a holiday with him because I am anticipating some big quarrel. We used to manage to get into fight every time we went somewhere. Usually it would start with him assuming that I had done something disrespectful such as not looked at him while we were conversing etc. This has also improved, but it still feels rather scary to go somewhere with him. Finally, he used to disappear on me when he was on work trips. It would happen that he would not contact me for a week. I sometimes called him once or twice, but when he did not pick up, gave up myself as well. He is still not superactive when he is in a foreign country to contact me, rather he keeps me waiting. Finally, he does his plans without consulting me. He booked his vacation without a word to me. When he is on his vacation, he is spending most of his time together with his friends families, finding rather little time for me. When I have tried to talk about getting our own children, he keeps telling me, that we are not ready and that the relationship is not good enough. At this point I am rather miffed. Should I continue because he is regularly sweet to me and makes me feel loved, or should I leave because he is rather unreliable and not really consistant with his sweetness. All advice welcome!
Should I continue?
Submitted by waldewin on 08/02/2016.
You already know the answer
Submitted by adhd32 on
Consistently Inconsistent
Submitted by kellyj on
That seems to be the hall mark of having ADHD. I am this way myself in my own ways so I must consider this anytime I might see someone else who has ADHD as my means to access their behavior.
The improvements you say you see .....but you are still feeling "scary" yourself....would indicate to me that an effort is being made and more room for you to deal with the anxiousness that causes you to be afraid that seem "scary" to you as you perceive his behavior.
You can't predict or head off the future from happening....but you can be more proactive yourself within reason. Expecting more of the same might only make you more afraid....but it you can deal with your own insecurities and fear....you might be able to adjust yourself better to the situation you've found yourself in.
Within reason of course. Things are not black and white. But it's a good idea to know who you are with. If they seem rather black and white to you....it might be good for you to see these two sides independently of one another, so you can expect, and be more proactive about one...and be more in anticipation of the other.
I know this is difficult to do sometimes and not lose objectivity....but it might serve you to deal with your fears in order to differentiate your fears.....from the person and these qualities they have and not see them as a "whole" and as the person themselves.
It doesn't mean you have to like it....but to be with them and not be afraid....it might help you to do this.
J
Thank you Jamieson for this
Submitted by waldewin on
Thank you Jamieson for this very good advice. Let me just comment briefly on the things you mentioned,
First, yes, I have abandonment fears which clash with his inconsistency big-time. I have been working on these for years, but the problem is, his behavior also makes it vastly more difficult for me to make headway. I am going to continue in therapy to arrive to the point where my abandonment fears will not interfere with my life to significant extent, but I am not sure how much progress I can even expect.
Second point, I also do have fears of others judging me and especially aggressive behavior from my childhood as well. I grew up in a quite inconsistent household where my mothers moods were from time to time impossible to predict. This has also been a focus in my therapy for long time.
With both these issues, I believe in working on myself to be the best self possible.
The problem is, I do not have indefinite time and I am reaching to the point where I would want to have children. My partner keeps putting the issue off, usually telling me that I need to work on something in my therapy. He sometimes crudgingly admits, after I have confronted him, that actually he is afraid of being a parent as well, but I do see only little steps in this department.
Additionally, I sometimes wonder how much of his behavior is caused by adhd and how much of it are some complexes. I can at least name few issues he has independently of adhd- inability to take criticism (hence putting all the issues in the relationship on me), feeling easily disrespected etc. Similarly, with his inconsistency, I have trouble deciding how much of it is adhd. For instance now, since we are taking out vacations separately, we have not communicated for a week. I finally decided not to accommodate to his time schedule anymore. In the past, since I was the needy side, I was always attempting to hold up the communication, but now I am forcing myself to the similar attitude as his, namely not initiating contact, not changing my plans according to him, not showing any flexibility in terms of our meetings and the result has been, that it has been impossible to agree on a meeting for the whole week. I am not sure how related to adhd this is. When we have discussed this issue in the past, he has been rather unwilling to make any changes and insinuated that I should get myself better social life and not assume that I am the center of his world.
My general feeling is tiredness, because it feels that I am investing disproportionally way more on this relationship and we do not even have kids yet. He is doing some work, but I feel that it is always my job to make things work, to work with myself to solve the issues, because as a long as his issues do not disturb him, for him, they are not really issues. He keeps referring back to me and telling me to get a grip on myself, but I am noticing more and more indifference. I am rarely even angry, it is just this feeling that I do not have energy to deal with his mood swings, his short fuse and his unwillingness to cooperate around our issues. Most of the time, I frankly feel more like I am single than I am in the relationship. It also feels to me, that a lot of the times he does act like he is single. He has now stopped flirting other women in my presence, but he still gives me very little attention when we are out, makes plans without consulting me and refuses to make changes if he sees at least a little bit of a possibility that my complexes could be involved.
The bottom line is, to me, it seems, that we are dealing with more than his adhd. What are your opinions? As ADHD goes, I think he is managing rather well and I am really proud of him, because he can keep his job, he is now starting to work on his finances and he has developed a system for keeping his appointments.
Things That Might Help You See the Big Picture
Submitted by kellyj on
Waldawin,
First off....let me say that you are really showing how much you care about your relationship with your H by coming here and trying to figure this all out. There are so many things within what you laid out for me to see....that at least....I can tell you what I have come to understand....doing the very thing you're doing and simply trying to get some idea of what you are seeing?
Instead of working backwards from all the things you said....one item at a time....I can tell you one thing for sure....everything is related to ADHD in some form or another. Not to scare you anymore...but so you can begin to see him as being separate from all of these behaviors and the things he's said to you.
Itemizing some of the things out you said here that I have gone through or experienced myself at one time or another.
Children: I don't have children...but only in part that my first wife a long time ago immediately wanted to have children and I was scared to death. We tried for a while and it didn't work. I didn't need to go too far down the road of figuring out why or who....before she ran off with someone else and left me there dumb founded. No need to say your sorry for me since this was a blessing in disguise for me and I see it that for way two reasons;
One....I was pressured into marrying this women and felt like if I didn't...she would leave me. This was the impression she made on me...but part of that was my own abandonment issues kicking into play here. This was in my early thirties (30 exactly at the time we got married)...and something within that didn't feel right ....right from the start. It was as if....I only had two options to pick from. Either marry her and be with someone I was in Love with very much....or get married to her (against my better judgment) because I Loved her and didn't want to lose her. This was definitely not...in retrospect...a very good reason to get married at least....not done in "Shot Gun" fashion the way that went down. Being pressured into making one of the most important decisions you can make and not feeling ready or not sure if it's the right one....starts everything out on the wrong foot and being way out of synch with the other person who is ready and chomping at the bit and has their mind made up ahead of time and is sure of what they want. I'd have to kick myself in the head...before I would say that I can be that sure of anything that I have never done before. Any ideas or dreams of what I might have thought things would be like before I got there, pretty quickly vanished before my eyes once I was there in reality and a huge part (if not all of that) had to do with my ADHD and the symptoms and effect this had on my relationship.
What you are experiencing is this same effect coming from the other side of it but keep in mind...he is experiencing it too...coming from his side of things and you are both feeling things and experiencing this effect at the same time.... but totally different than each other. Of course...your you. You have your own ideas and thoughts about this along with all those concerns and fears yourself. Just know without question....he is experiencing it too but unable to articulate those things to you because he simply doesn't know how?
So if you look at that way....the effect is what you are feeling and experiencing but your feelings are not at all off base and your own intuition here as I hear you...is pretty much right on the mark. What you're not getting from him...is anything to explain this to you if I hear what you are saying?
His fears as I would be....are about concerns that are real. Those aren't about you, not wanting to have children, or not wanting the same things you want. His fears about being afraid he will actually be able to do it once he gets there to that place. The reason for this is ADHD...not him. Having ADHD causes you to doubt if you can do things sometimes from failing in the past but not knowing why that is. Even made with the best intentions and effort....something seems to get in the way of that and cause you to fail. It's all ADHD related in one way or another even if indirectly since all these things tie together one way or another.
From witnessing this with my own sister....I watched this play out with her from the side lines and it was really easy for me to see. Since I know her so well and she would tell me things as we went along about her life and how things were going...the one thing that I saw which was almost and form of psychotic reaction (said faticiously) was when her biological clock timer went off and there was no stopping that run away train once it left the station. lol (again just from a male perspective) Not saying men don't get this way either...but as I seen and talked to plenty of men...this is not some strange phenomenon. lol
But from my sister...she would say these things straight up to me. As I recalled she said when the timer alarm went off...she knew it immediately and she just had to have a child and that was the only thing on her mind period. As she said it. She explained to me this almost took her over and it happened over night almost. This is coming from a woman who was fiercely independent and lived alone and renounced relationships only a few years before. Fiercely independent might be putting it mildly. lol She was one of the most self contained and self reliant woman I have ever met. But the same as I am....she had kind of one track mind once she got started so when her mind got changed...it changed in an about face and went completely the other direction almost over night from as she put it....her "biological clock." From my perspective being a man...I have never experienced that before and am not anticipating this ever at this time. lol
So if you take what I said about how I decided to get married the first time....there was a pressure put on me almost like an ultimatum but that was me....doing that to myself and caving in without being ready. In my case...both...the reason to get married and my faulty reasoning to have a child were both not of my choosing but felt I had to...in order to stay with the person I was in Love with...with no other choice. That is...at the time I felt like that.
So if you can stand back and see my side of how I felt and why I did what I did....you might apply that to your situation now and stop and consider a few things here.
There's good reason for (me) and possibly your H....feeling the way he does and saying the things he's said. Because he's concerned he will actually be able to do the things that are required of him once he gets there and all of that is related to having ADHD. He wants those things...but he doesn't know how he will do it yet and that right there...is a very valid reason on his part because of all the past failures he knows...when he attempted to do thing before. You may not know this...and he may not be telling you specifically why and what those things are...but he knows the failures...and that's pretty much all he knows?
If I could go back in time...and do it all over again...this is the conversation I would be having with you right now...as if I were your H.
I'd say "Waldewin...I Love you very much and I never want to lose you or be without you in my life....but I have some real concerns here that I want to address with you right now before we do anything else or make any new decisions about the future. Can we step back here and start from the beginning and look at where we are now...before we jump right into the next stages and think things over for a while. My ADHD imposes some real challenges on me that make me afraid of having children right at this very moment. Not ever....but I feel like I'm being pressured into making a decision before I have some things figured out first. I've been playing catch up for most of my life it seems...but only in certain ways and not others and thos ways all have to do with the challenges that having ADHD present to me. I'm still trying to get a handle on those things and really think it's important that I do that for myself first...before I do anything else and get caught up before we move on to the next thing on the list. Having a baby...will add so many new responsibilities to the once I'm still working on (and have yet to master) that I think I'm not going to able to do them and you will leave me if I don;t say yes to you right now this very minute and just use your biological clock as the timer and feel like I'm running out of time and the pressure I feel is enormous due to this fact. I'd like to slow down a little...and take things one at a time so we're both on the same page together and we're both prepared for everything that is going to come and all that goes with it....once we pull that trigger."
W.....it won't take you very long to browse through this forum...to read all the complaint lodged against the men with ADHD who are married and have children to read a horror list of night mare stories of all the things that happen...when this very thing your mentioned manifest...when the ADHD(man) doesn't have his ducks lined up and everything sorted out ahead of time. Putting it bluntly....not having their shit together.
And what I mean by not having their shit together....means not addressing their ADHD and do the work ahead of time...to make sure these things don't happen. Once you're there....it's too late to do much but play catch up and be behind the 8 ball indefinitely or until they have the chance to work on these things in their spare time while trying to manage everything else all together at once. This is a nightmare....for both people and it's easy to see the results of this of this by the failure numbers of marriages falling apart and getting divorced because of it. I'm no exception....but I have learned one thing to give you any advise at all.
Slow down. Stop and have a conversation about this with him first and see if he doesn't start admitting these same things to you but I wouldn't jump on him all at once and try to talk about everything too fast and break each one of the problems down but apply ADHD to them...instead of him as the person. The ADHD is the problem and the cause for the effect you are experiencing so looking at it that way....that might give you a better foot to start on to have that conversation.
The wrong foot as I'm saying this with no offense to you (based on my understanding that I explained) is to say "My biological clock is ticking and I'm running out of time and need to have a baby...right NOW!!! "
You don't need to have a baby right now. ( I don't know how old you are?)...but in a while yes. Not right now does not mean never. Getting into that black and white kind of all or nothing...now or never kind of thinking will surely create some problems for you if you approach him that way.
On his behalf...as if I were speaking to him. I'd be saying "it's now or never....get your shit together boy...get your act together and get on the ball. You need to address these symptoms and start....like ASAP....yesterday...even better. Know what I mean?"
He would know what I mean...but he still wouldn't know what to do or how to address the problem. That takes some dedicated effort and some time to figure this out. How much time...will depend on him...but adding a baby to the list in the mean time might be doing the very thing that you fear most....cause your marriage to fall apart which would be a self filling prophecy to your abandonment issues. In respect to your abandonment issues...they not you either. I might be saying the same things too you as I did with him (in my example)...but probably would say it differently with a little more tack coming at you from speaking to you as a woman and trying to more sensitive to your needs as such.
You got some drives and needs that are different than his...all you really need to do is be aware they exist and try to be sensitive to them at the very least an not assume his...are the same as yours which almost certainly and not........even if the goal is the same.
So if you can stand back and look at what I just said.....you might see him going off and doing some things and trying to do things that make no sense to you what so ever. And even if he can't explain them to you....ADHD is in there somewhere directing his behavior...and for a good reason as I said. These concerns of his are recall...the same as your concerns are to you. Getting on the same page is coming it from that direction and I think that will help a great deal to be able to talk about what is not being said.
The inconsistency thing however....will still happen consistently to a certain degree in some things. The real problems areas and the things that can be a problem for both of you he seems like he's tackling right now as we speak. If you were to create a time line and do the math and see how much time it will take to address each thing fully ....one item at a time like he's working on. That inconsistency will diminish rather quickly if he can stay on it without having anything else added to it...right away until he gets those things taken care of first.
I don't know, how much time you've got left on your ticker....but 2 years of work and staying on it....seems to be a reasonable time for someone working on these things to get control of them. That would be reasonable on your end....as long as he stays within it or close with in reason.
If I were you and want to be with him....I would add a fudge factor to everything he does....and add a little more time to what he says automatically without actually saying so but just expect that instead. Set your mental watch 1/2 hour ahead...and pretend it's reading the right time anyway.
I have a friend who is very much like this but he's always consistently late for everything. We have a name for anything he says when it comes to the time he says he will be there.
There's normal time....and then there's Mike time. Mike time is 45 minutes later...than everyone else.
If I were you...I would use "Mike time" and sustitute "ADHD time" and use that when you apply anything but expanding that proportionately.....minutes, hours, weeks, years.
If you use "ADHD time" instead and use that as your means to plan your life or all the daily things you do.,..you won't waiting...and expecting instead. ha ha. That was a pun....without intention. Funny how that happens sometimes. Maybe that's a sign?
Good luck...I hope that was what you were looking for?
J
Dear Jamieson,
Submitted by waldewin on
Dear Jamieson,
First off let me tell you that your response is spot on and a very good description of our situation. I really appreciate you taking time and consulting me in this issue.
I think, on a subconscious level, I do understand that his adhd is having a termendeous effect on our relationship, it is just this little part at the back that keeps hoping that somehow he will be able to change. I keep hoping that he will keep all his good sides that I am in love with and become more responsible and less helpless. I know, that this is more of a dream for me rather than an actual possibility. After four years, I still feel that I have no idea what I have gotten myself into. It is difficult to anticipate how things will be in a year or two. Add kids to this mess and it becomes increasingly challenging to imagine.
My partner has so many good sides and I do think I love him for better or worse. I am just not sure I can live with him. This is the most challenging part, to try to assess if you can imagine a long-term relationship with them. Right now we are still having a situation where I am constantly anxious and cannot sleep. I also cry regularly. This is not normal. I do realize I have to take some responsibility over my emotions, but I feel that not all of it belongs to me.
Your description helped me to make sense of his emotions and his side of the story. It does break my heart to imagine what he must be going through. I care deeply about him and I have always wanted to help him with his struggles. I however also do realize that I am not the best person to compensate his problems. Unfortunately I am not one of those super practical people who can handle all his weak points on my own. I really do not make a great secretary. Where I can help is providing him some psychological help, but I am genuinely worried about how we could manage a family with our limitations.