I ran across this website by Lynne Forrest the other day and when I read her descriptions of this psych- model it really was enlightening. ( I had one of those "Holy Shit!" this is good stuff moments ) I'm not endorsing anyone here or trying to make recommendations to anyone.....or assuming that this will be helpful or not for anyone else. (I found the sight randomly when I was searching for some things I was curious about)....but what I got out of it really helped answer a lot of questions ( or understand better? ) to many things I can see in myself and other people. I find that when this happens for me, it gives me more perspective and consequently..... more compassion. Better said....it helps me change anger to compassion and that is never a bad thing.
I wasn't even sure where I should put this topic here in this forum because it answered so many questions that I have had concerning: anger, communication, intuition, memory and just simply being totally baffled at times when I have been confronted with certain people that seem to change personalities right in front of my eyes.....sometimes within the same conversation or even within the same sentence???? What I realized after reading this was that I wasn't so far off the mark but I couldn't put a name on what I was seeing until now. This also include myself in so many situation I can think off when I really look closely to how I felt at the time and my behavior that followed. Instead of trying to interpret this for anyone else who might be interested I'll just leave it here for you to decide for yourself......but I immediately thought of all the posts and questions here on this forum that might possibly be explained from this point of view. I realize that not everyone responds to these things the way I do and it might not for you. I have found however, that the more ways I can see the same thing ( explained differently)....the better I am able to understand and see these things myself and be less baffled overall! lol
The one conclusion that I have made quite some time ago about myself regarding my ADHD compared to before I was diagnosed is.......that possibly anyone who has some kind of disability, disorder or handicap ( I know handicap is not PC anymore but I still think it has it's place in the dictionary... thinking like in golf here) or anything that makes them stand out in any way from the norm.......the likely hood of feeling like a victim to it at some point is very high. I know for myself....this is absolutely true and I can use all the help I can get! lol
http://www.lynneforrest.com/articles/2008/06/the-faces-of-victim/
Hey...I'm in the Way
Submitted by s00manyquestions on
Hey...I'm in the Way beginning of her teachings..? if thats what you call them. Anyways...sof ar, I'm hooked and it's already answered questions regarding -- all aspects of my life. Just taking a break from it. Honestly...jus found this site and I've read more in these past few days than I have in 2yrs!!?? Seriously.Right now..being freshly diagnosed...things are a bit overwhelming. I ponder often: concluding with no resolve...ending in more questions. It's refreshing to have some sort of tangible thing. Speaking of conclusions...its ironic..but I really relate to and or thank you for the heads up... on all of your conclusions! They bring more questions..but hey...I still have some reading to do...here comes some more answers!! hehe.
1.) .... it gives me more perspective and consequently..... more compassion. Better said....it helps me change anger to compassion and that is never a bad thing.
2.) I have found however, that the more ways I can see the same thing ( explained differently)....the better I am able to understand and see these things myself and be less baffled overall! lol
3.) ...the likely hood of feeling like a victim to it at some point is very high. I know for myself....this is absolutely true and I can use all the help I can get! lol
http://www.lynneforrest.com/articles/2008/06/the-faces-of-victim/
Yup..me again. Another break
Submitted by s00manyquestions on
Yup..me again. Another break. so far..OMG!! Hitting way (too) close to home..Wow. Great find! I sent it to my sister who is also on a journey or self discovery.
Hi J....
Submitted by c ur self on
I just read your post and I will come back and check out the site, when I have more time...I know based on what you've said here it will interest me...I can change personalities with-in the same sentence...and it's usually based on my perception of what's being said...(and in the past it was because I felt I have to respond to every invitation...lol...) I've always been quiet emotional, for a man anyway..It run's in the family, my dad and brother are the same. I can react way to quickly and most always regret it later...I've gotten better at that...I've come to understand for me...Not recognizing my emotions, intellect and will can be my own undoing...
C
Hi c ur self
Submitted by kellyj on
After I wrote this I looked at the way I write...my phrasing etc....if you notice, my use of ( ) where I interject secondary thoughts into the middle of sentences. Unfortunately for people who have to listen to me speak which is somewhat the same in real time....I know this can be frustrating. It is for me too! lol But I think this is a perfect example of someone with ADHD trying to speak sometimes too........getting too many thoughts coming in at once and not being able to organize them verbally at times. I'm very aware of this one aspect and I have to stop and slow down to say things intelligibly. Anyone who knows me knows this one aspect of my ADHD for sure.
But...this in not what is being discussed in the link ( the web site). I think you will find it interesting . It is another version ( or model ) of attachment theory but more having to do with family dynamics and how they affect all of us. This includes everyone not just those with ADHD. I think it could possibly be useful to all non ADHD'ers out there trying to distinguish the difference between the ADHD and other parts of a persons personality which is exactly what it does when I'm am trying to do the same thing for myself.
J
Noticed that..:)
Submitted by c ur self on
Like you said it's good stuff though...I've struggled with some of those things...My marriage has really taken off for the better since I realized I had to back off, live and let live...No matter how different my view of life is...
My wife and 24 year old son was putting a puzzle together last night as I was touring the site...So, I just read some it to them...My step son is 24 and grew up w/out a Father. He is a good young man but has struggled some what taking on the responsibility of being a man...My wife tends to make it worse enabling him to some degree, probably a little out of the guilt she carries...It's not uncommon, my Mom does the same to my brother's...We grew up w/out a Father's in the home also.
After I read about the all three types on the triangle...He ask me whose web site I was reading from and I told him...Maybe it hit a nerve in him...it did me:)...Our greatest pain is usually our greatest learning opportunities....Thanks again for sharing....
C
Our greatest pain is usually
Submitted by s00manyquestions on
Our greatest pain is usually our greatest learning opportunities.
Love that!! As of late...my world has been thrown about, skin torn and left vunerable. I like to think of myself as an honest, hardworking, itegrity based, caring individual. Al least...that's what I WANT to think. I feel as if I'm entering a differnent level of space..where all of my conceptions of life, relationships (general and personal), theory,My jouney of ME....ME!!! I'm finding I have No ideal who I am. I have had a false illusion of my life...it's dulussional life that I don't want to loose. Not the person, or even the home..but maybe the kittens...boo. All (very few) answers are lost.
I love that last quote because it gives me hope...that yes...there is a bit of sun shimmering behind the clouds.
It's fantastic that your children and family are now apart of your journey. They can ride beside you..and shake heads in the wind togegther!!
You sound like me 00...
Submitted by c ur self on
Sorry that's no compliment...:(...I thought of myself about the same as you....Worked hard, same job for 37 years...etc..etc...But, that was my problem...Look what I did! Not look how blessed I am...Basically I was telling my add wife...Let me force this responsible life style down your throat...even though it's nothing you can comprehend...But, just trust me....I know what I'm doing....What an insensitive butt hole:(
I had to puke up (still do daily) who I really am...The prideful man, stuck in his own self-righteousness...ugh:(
A...ghhh...All Ive read is
Submitted by s00manyquestions on
A...ghhh...All Ive read is you first line...your so like me...not a good thing. Boo. I'm here and forcing my resisting body to comply with my mind!! If we're on this gravy train together....only the good stuff (w/in this new place "they" call: reality!!) ohh..it's true. Positive reenforcements.It doesn't matter who you are...even if your a walruses..just a mammal..it'll work!! hehe think good and enlighenting future..deep in self acknowledgement and sown to the earth. Always filled with ~Love and Patience~
---------------------------
Submitted by s00manyquestions on
--------------------------- NOT a GOOD x ample: ------------------------
F'n, F'n F'n, SHIT!!!! I'm about to flip my lid.. I lost the f'n tread again. This means......I have to ask HIM how to slow the sensitivity to my keyboard mouse. ANY one???
Good with PC computers?
Submitted by s00manyquestions on
save me from interacting with my BF who's kicking me out in 4 dAYS!!
I had to puke up (still do
Submitted by s00manyquestions on
I had to puke up (still do daily) who I really am...The prideful man, stuck in his own self-righteousness...ugh:(
I was just thinking "that" thought the other day....I even gave the verb of puking! Although it might have been a bit more graffically. I agree with you emmesley on that one. I think if anyone is to move forward and/or transform into a better version of themselves...they need to know where they're stand now. Kinda like the ..'You're Here mark on the mall maps.) How are you supposed to go to where you want to go if you don't know where you are now?
This thought is DEF going to stay with me for awhile...maybe even a lifetime of growing and transforming for the better! Thanks for that!!!
We are all responsible for our own Happiness...
Submitted by c ur self on
What it has come down to for me s00 is Peace...I've got to have it...Nothing is worth not having it...So I try to live my life in an accountable fashion, accountable to myself, to never let myself seek love and fellowship where it is not offered and freely given...I can't afford to be needy...Needy isn't fair to my wife or others...It has caused me much (self inflicted) pain....
Also, I have to make sure, I don't use others, that the love I reach out with is unconditional...Also, I must be at peace and never try to force love if its rejected...I can never afford to measure my self-worth by the actions of another created human! Man, you talk about a peace killer:)...I must be at peace!
So often I've read posts on this forum (written my share also) that is our judgments' of how life should be...And our judgments of how others should be...Based on our opinions' LOL...So, yep...Just need to puke that mindset up...Live peaceable as possible with all men, and women:)
The results has been amazing...Too kind of sum it up...I reached over and kissed my wife good night a few nights ago...And I just said to her....Do you think we have a lot to be thankful for in this marriage?....She didn't take long to say I do!
I've said this before, but, it is worth repeating...Expectation's must die in any relationship, and be replaced with Acceptance....We can live peaceably when we Accept vs Expect...Acceptance does not mean you always agree with your spouse or others...It just means you are willing to accept the reality of what is in front of you...Expectations sends your peace to hell....
I hope great peace for you s00...
Peace
Submitted by jennalemone on
I must be at peace and never try to force love if its rejected.
This is powerful. I cannot make myself love someone who is not trying. I cannot enable or support someone in the hopes that they will love me for it.
When we are younger, our anger motivates us to change a situation. We have the energy and the future ahead of us. When we are older, acceptance is sometimes the only road to peace.
I here you Jen....
Submitted by c ur self on
Addressing your statements Jen, based on my own life...(I can not love someone who is not trying)...I got very angry and bitter measuring my reality of what love should look like. And, using my attempts and ability (what my mind was producing) to serve and give myself to her, as my rule to judge what was coming back to me in return. It didn't matter if she was capable or not...
(I cannot enable or support someone in the hopes that they will love me for it)...I agree with this:) Enabling and supporting a man who refuses his role, is the opposite of loving him, and in the end will destroy the relationship...
There are many Illusions' we human's are susceptible to....Not the least of which is thinking we can force a relationship...And the second is like unto it....thinking we can control another human being....
If being an example by living a peaceful and responsible (responsible to my own vows) life doesn't have a positive impact....No amount of anger, judgments and expectations will ever produce this Love we so desperately desire....
Jesus gave me a picture of true love...But, sadly I keep rejecting it much of the time...because it's not the selfish kind....Lord forgive me, and open my blinded eyes....
have to comment
Submitted by jennalemone on
c ur self
Enabling and supporting a man who refuses his role, is the opposite of loving him, and in the end will destroy the relationship...
Explain this please. I know you are not saying that my enabling and supporting my husband destroyed the relationship, are you?
No Jen I'm not...
Submitted by c ur self on
What I'm saying is, when I took my Vows (Promises)...To God...and to my wife...I became a servant to her, to fulfill those promises (vows). Regardless of her commitment to her own vows...But, it works both ways....It's never my responsibility to force, explain, tell her, her role...Never!...But there again, it works both ways....
What I'm saying is any time a Husband or Wife refuses there roles as appointed by God himself...Then it forces the home and marriage into a situation that is unhealthy, and usually abusive.
Sadly from both our posts we've both lived through the reality of this imbalance! When this refusal to accept the responsibility (live up to our promises) to the marriage and family happens....The product is usually disagreements, hurts, defensiveness, lose of respect...And like I said it will destroy the relationship....
I do not have to tell you this :( Just because many of us still co-exist, doesn't mean our relationships are one of love and peace...One where our promises are being daily nurtured and lived out....
Also, I have to make sure, I
Submitted by s00manyquestions on
Also, I have to make sure, I don't use others, that the love I reach out with
is unconditional...Also, I must be at peace and never try to force love if
its rejected...I can never afford to measure my self-worth by the actions of
another created human!
back for a sec.
'never try to force love if its rejected.I can never afford to measure my self worth by the actions of another created human' keeps coming back to me. I struggle yet see the need for this. VPR really threw my head for a loop..self worth...defined at childhood and the connection of what you expect of yourselof and how others treat you. Mine was not pleasant and have always placed it back back there...thinking: its happened...it was and not now. I'm over it and nothing else. But it seems to come back at me. Self Worth....force love if its rejected. I know this...really...at least I say the words and hope it becomes. My situation with 'the breakup' is complicated. Due to the lost of our son last year....it's all joined. grief...giving space vs being there...support or needy..?? withdrawing or isolating? The lines are and have been very much blurred and now...ADHD. Where does and where DID it effect me...us..?
We Were close...connected and a strong couple prior...we supported one another with every bit of air we could grasp...but when 'it' happened...LOST. Givng space turned to distance...giving space turned to pushing 'me' away...the dark void...lost...frustration and anger leading to resentment. Leading to further depression and shame. Co Dependant, pressure and Adult/child relationship. Swich gear of anger, outrage and burts of pure anger just trying to find the ground....denfending self out of survival...? or the thought of it. NEEDING H to want Us for me to survive. .... My Worth=His NEED for me...NOO! Childhood... ... acknowledge, reconcile w past, love myself for the beauty that I am as Me and loving me for being me.
Wow. So that was way more than a sec. I think. I don't even know if any of it made sense but as i typed...I was following my own lane. .. I hope you followed. Thanks again for joining me and supporting me on my new journey.
ps. I'm trying NOT to be my normal perfectionist...and not make tying corrections as I type and or after. just save and later re read.
k. Gotta pack!!
One more thing since I read another response. I thing I was originally trying to say is: I'm confused at the relationship between us just ended without conversation. I had been asking for him to talk to me for months prior and suddenly....I guess I FORCED it out: and he broke it off...appearently he knew for awhile. My threat: is the breakup happening because of us as individuals or is it because he is a man who doesn't know or have ever learned how to recognize, accept and or communicate his 'feelings.' As he's shared with me in the past: biggest fear he has: to be his father who is exactly what I just said. And now: he IS his father. ....Pushing me out to block out our lost...as if: if i'm gone, there's nothing left to remind him of the events. OR...relationship communication challenges?...my 'needs' ./.? Prob ALL..in one giant rubber band ball. Either way: Yes...I can 'control' my thoughts...no one else.
I am so sorry for your loss.
Submitted by AlmaVera on
I am so sorry for your loss. I cannot imagine how hard all of this must be for you right now. I remember when my parents lost my sister shortly after birth. I think it was the start of their long road to the end, too. My dad had an extremely difficult time expressing his grief...and that was the product of his childhood, just as you said about your H. It is incredibly difficult to change a dysfunctional legacy that is passed down from one generation to the next. Somehow, no matter how painful our childhoods were, and how much we vowed not to repeat what our parents did, we carry it inside if we were raised in the same dysfunctional setting, too. Perhaps, your H just never had the 'training' when he was a child in how to process his own emotions in a healthy way, and so couldn't be there for you, either. Again, I'm so sorry.
It is really important that you don't try to tell yourself that what causes you to feel the way you do about yourself is in your past and that it shouldn't affect you anymore. It is THE main thing that causes you to see yourself the way you do now. If there are wounds inside, even ones you can't consciously remember, they will come back up eventually. There are many different therapies out there to help with this kind of thing, such as those dealing with healing the 'inner child.' I haven't had much luck with 'talking' to my inner child, personally. I think I'm too logical. But if you're interested, there is a psychologist named Jonice Webb who has written articles on Childhood Emotional Neglect on the PsychCentral website, and has also written a book on it called Running On Empty. I got it from my library. The articles and her book were really helpful to me in seeing that even with the work I'd been doing on myself, there were still things I hadn't touched yet, and they were still affecting my adult life, especially relationships. Here is a description of it in a nutshell: https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/stop-walking-eggshells/201308/the-i...
and here is a list of Jonice Webb's blog posts, most on Childhood Emotional Neglect: http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/author/jonice-webb/
I can't tell you how your ADHD played into things, and right now, you really can't go there. It doesn't help you in this moment when you have so much going on. But the things you're expressing above could happen to anyone, with or without ADHD. What's important right now is that you have compassion for yourself, and take care of yourself. Big squishy hugs to you.
Bless you both...So sorry for what you are enduring....
Submitted by c ur self on
It sounds like you have a good feel for him...When that kind of deep emotional pain hits some men they will seek to block it out...Sadly they also can turn cold and distant...Where others will draw closer, some men do not know how to ask for help. Probably most of us:(...Looking for something to blame or some way to make sense of it so we can have some closure, Someway to have a little peace in our souls again...
It sounds like he is in deep emotional distress...I hope you can see this reality HE is locked in...You really shouldn't blame yourself for it, nor try and take responsibility for him...You need to deal with your own pain, and your own future...There is healing for you both....